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Topic: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excellent (Read 2105 times) |
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12gagueblast
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Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excellent
« on: Jan 4th, 2004, 8:29pm » |
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,107274,00.html
If you are a subject in Europe your government will not want you to read this. If you are a citizen of the U.S. please read before it is too late and we are also subjects.
(Sorry the pot hasn't been stirred for a while.) 
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jimmers
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #1 on: Jan 4th, 2004, 9:10pm » |
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Great reading!
I'll add my two cents worth later.
Seeya,
Jimbo
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Charlie
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #2 on: Jan 4th, 2004, 11:30pm » |
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Cable news networks exist to scare the shit out of their listeners. My suggestion is to whack cable news for this.
No one is more guilty of this than Fox by the way.
Charlie: A dangerous liberal who owns more than one gun.
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KingOfPain
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #3 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 12:54am » |
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I live in a Make My Day (law) state.
I own guns that are ALWAYS loaded.
There are no trigger locks on my guns.
There are no children in my home.
Choice between my life & an intruder's?
I choose my survival.
The only people that have reason to fear
my guns are criminals coming into my house.
That's all I have to say about that.
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We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter.
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forgetfulnot
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #4 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 1:20am » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 12:54am, KingOfPain wrote:I live in a Make My Day (law) state.
I own guns that are ALWAYS loaded.
There are no trigger locks on my guns.
There are no children in my home.
Choice between my life & an intruder's?
I choose my survival.
The only people that have reason to fear
my guns are criminals coming into my house.
That's all I have to say about that. |
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10-4 steve 100%l
Lee....
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Callico
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #5 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 1:28am » |
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An excellent article. While I at present do not have a gun im my home I plan to obtain one shortly. I have been trained in their use, and am strongly in favor of people retaining the right to defend themselves. The only caveat I would attach to personal gun ownership would be that each person who has a weapon should be trained in the proper and safe usage of it. On two seperate occasions having a gun on my person saved me from holdups when I was running a gas station. (They didn't make the news either,)
Just my two cents worth although I think their value much higher.
Be safe and PF
jc
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BobG
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #6 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 4:06am » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 1:28am, Callico_Kid wrote:The only caveat I would attach to personal gun ownership would be that each person who has a weapon should be trained in the proper and safe usage of it.
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That should also be required of those that get a driver’s license or a cell phone.
BobG-gun owner
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ClusterChuck
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #7 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 6:19am » |
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I do not own a gun, and do not plan on owning one. I have nothing against those that do, it is just I don't trust myself. I am afraid that one of these times I will pull it out and use it, not to kill myself, but to blow my head off so that it won't hurt anymore. I think there have been times in the past, where I would have done that. I am not so prone to those thoughts since I found my CH family, but I still will not take the chance.
Just my personal concerns.
Chuck
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Kirk
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #8 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 8:12am » |
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Being from Oregon and a former Marine my feelings on the matter may be prejudiced somewhat.
Everyone should be taught safe firearm practices, from early on.
This will more than likely prevent most accidental harm caused by fire arms.
"An armed society, is perforce a polite society"
So as my Gunny said. Get a grip.
Remember a gun is a weapon with a bore over 105 MM diameter. Be carefull with that thar pistol now.
TTFN
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TomM
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #9 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 8:49am » |
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This is a piss poor example of why we SHOULD have guns. The excuse of how many crimes were thwarted by gun wielding citizens is lame.
Those of us who own guns (I personally own 13) AND are law-abiding citizens who have had training (NRA, Boy Scouts, and Military) are NOT the people (Note that I qualified this statement with law abiding) who commit crimes with guns.
Training at an early age is key. I had my first training with a .22 rifle in the Boy Scouts at age 11 in a National Guard Armory, taken the NRA safety class more times than I can count, and have had extensive training with .45 Colts, M16's and riot shot guns during my tenure in the Coast Guard.
Knowing when to use and how to handle a weapon is the key element. Friends from my office have asked to go pheasant hunting with me but when I found out they 1) do not own a gun; 2) have never handled a gun. and most importantly, 3) never had training I politely refuse. I tell them to take an NRA gun safety class, get a hold of me and we'll go a range and practice, then I'll take you hunting.
Guns are not more dangerous than a drunk driver, a speeding teenager or a plane laden with fuel headed to the Twin Towers. Hell, all men have the potential to rape just because we have a penis but that does not make us criminals. The same is true for gun owners. That, my friends, should be the argument. Not that more crimes are prevented by gun wielding citizens.
OK--blast away...
TomM
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| « Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2004, 9:38am by TomM » |
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Kirk
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #10 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 9:14am » |
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Will you look at that a "coastie" who thinks he knows firearms. On top of that he makes sense.
Next thing you know he'll be able to hit what he's aiming at.
Maybe there is hope after all.
TTFN
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Paigelle
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #11 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 9:18am » |
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I grew up around guns. My grandparents have a farm and there are guns everywhere. We were taught to respect guns, not fear them. We were also taught how to use them, if we needed to. Most of the men in my family would hunt, so they carried guns all over the farm. We don't have a gun right now, because we haven't bought one. But I only fear a gun in the hands of someone who wants to use it for crime or hasn't been taught to use a gun properly, not for protection or hunting. Does that make any sense?
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TomM
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #12 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 9:49am » |
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Paige--there are many reasons to carry a gun on a farm mainly rodents.
Kirk--say after me..."This my weapon. This is my gun. This is for fighting and this is for fun." Remember that? Note that I did not write 'Repeat...'.
Haven't met a jar head I did not like. 
Have you ever noticed how on TV show or the movies or music videos that the gun wielding thugs shoot with the pistol handle parallel to the gound? No wonder they can't hit the broad side of a barn and no wonder innocent bystanders are shot on the streets.
Just an observation.
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KenB
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #13 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 10:49am » |
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Unfortunately a liberal gun culture also leads to:
http://history1900s.about.com/library/weekly/aa041303a.htm
In Ireland handguns are against the law - the police don't even carry them! However, we experience very little gun related crime. It's a chicken or egg argument.
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floridian
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I'm not afraid of guns (I own several) - I am afraid of some of the ass-hats that own guns. New Years Eve comes, and several people in my neighborhood think they are Sadam Hussein, firing guns in the air for celebration. Dumbasses don't bother to think about where the bullets come down, or how hard. One friend (different neighborhood) found a bullet hole in his roof when investigating a leak.
Quote:| "An armed society, is perforce a polite society" |
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Except for New Years Eve and the 4th of July, when the police just won't respond to reports of gun shots, unless someone witnessed the shots or reports a body. In a neighborhood with woods, hills and gulleys, and other complexities, you can hear alot but see little.
Gonna have to build me a 3-D phase array of microphones so I can triangulate the bastards.
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| « Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2004, 10:56am by floridian » |
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12gagueblast
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #15 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 12:10pm » |
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Ken this is not a gun culture that leads to this it is a reduction of the value of life and liberal morals that lead to this. I cant speak of irelands crime rates but london is now more dangerous than NY city, and gun crimes in england have sky rocketed since your gun ban. cant walk down the street there i here will find a suitable article to post to illustrate this point.
Subject or citizen i know my choice every time.
try reading Thomas Paines "Common Sence and the Rights of Man". I'm not sure if they print it over there but it has been in print over here for a couple of hundred years now.
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KenB
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #16 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 12:35pm » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 12:10pm, 12gagueblast wrote:| gun crimes in england have sky rocketed since your gun ban. |
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Ireland didn't ban guns in England.
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Big Dan
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #17 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 12:53pm » |
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... everyone who knows me know's where I stand here...
I carry my pistol in my truck at all times, clip in, nothing chambered... it's for my protection, and anyone that happens to be with me when I'm on the road, and it's in my nightstand when I'm at home...
... I was firing pistols/rifles/shotguns since the age of 8, and I've have a few hunter safety courses... I'm pretty confident that I'll know how to handle a situation should it arrive.... but I hope it never does...
... and the only way anyone will ever take my guns from me, is when they pry them from my cold, dead rotting carcass...
-Big Dan
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KingOfPain
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #18 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 12:59pm » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 6:19am, ClusterChuck wrote:I do not own a gun, and do not plan on owning one. I have nothing against those that do, it is just I don't trust myself. I am afraid that one of these times I will pull it out and use it, not to kill myself, but to blow my head off so that it won't hurt anymore. I think there have been times in the past, where I would have done that. I am not so prone to those thoughts since I found my CH family, but I still will not take the chance.
Just my personal concerns.
Chuck |
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I respect that.
Thank you for your honesty Chuck.
Pain Free Times To You (& all others).
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We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter.
- Denis Diderot
Real friendship is shown in times of trouble; prosperity is full of friends. - Euripides
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floridian
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #19 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 1:25pm » |
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Quote:| this is not a gun culture that leads to this it is a reduction of the value of life and liberal morals that lead to this. |
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I don't think that social decay is a left-right political thing, but if you want to examine it from that angle,
Infant mortality is highest in the conservative southern states, where the highest percent of people express a concern for "the value of life." Murder of women by men is also higher in the conservative southern states. Divorce is higher in the so-called Bible-Belt than in any other region of the US. And the overall murder rate among US states? Well, look for yourself (http://www.morganquitno.com/CR03samp1.pdf) ... the liberal areas of the US have far lower rates. Liberals may not talk about personal responsibility or the value of life as much as their opponents, but they seem to do more about implementing it in their lives.
The video game Doom, which was played obsessively by the Columbine killers, does glorify killing via guns. That is very different from responsibly using a firearm for sport or self defense. While most people who play violent video games do not go on to kill, a small percent of them are so fixated on the games that they will go on to act out their programming. And Doom and the hundreds of other violent video games are not the darlings of the liberals.
"Liberal morals" cause gun deaths? Like the idea that we should be tolerant of other ethnicities and religions? Or the idea that parents and voluntary associations should teach religion, instead of the government? Maybe the idea that government should help the handicapped, the poor, and the elderly is to blame? Or the insiduous idea that everybody benefits from state funded universities?
I really think that crime is more dependent on unemployment, untreated drug problems, insanity, and stupidity. Not sure what we can do against stupidity, but ask yourself who has supported improving mental health programs, and who has opposed the "medicalization" of depression and other mental conditions that lead to suicide and murder? "Culture" is an important but slippery factor, and having a strong, cohesive culture is pretty much independent of traditonal conservative/liberal ideology.
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| « Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2004, 1:34pm by floridian » |
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Hirvimaki
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #20 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 5:29pm » |
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Amen. It has become an easy out to polarize an issue. The "I'm right (because I'm conservative/liberal) and you are wrong (because you're conservative/liberal)" is as productive and logical as paddling with a tablespoon. And "declaring" the right or wrong of something does not make it so. I would much rather live in a world where little is said about personal responsibility, but where it is actually put into practice than in a world where people stomp their feet and delcare the righteousness of it and yet do not pratice it.
The issue of gun control is not as finite as the media nor the respective lobbies try to make it seem.
That being said, if you'd like to look over my fine collection of firearms, you are welcome to do so.
Hirvimaki
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eyes_afire
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Ramblings of a Madman (Esteban)
« Reply #21 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 6:45pm » |
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Ya know, it's funny, because I always have a hard time trying to explain my political views to people. And I usually don't get into these conversations because they often become so absurdly polarized.
I'm certainly no conservative.
Conservatives are scary.
I'm certainly no liberal.
Liberals are equally scary.
Case in point (Don't take this the wrong way Floridian. I very much agree with 50% of what you said, and I don't much like some of the alarmist conservative stuff from FOX, and the conservatives desire to mix morality with government nauseates me. I think you're rational enuff to understand my point without being offended. I guess in posting this, I'm naively wishing beyond hope that either liberals or conservatives could clarify their confusing positions):
Quote:| While most people who play violent video games do not go on to kill, a small percent of them are so fixated on the games that they will go on to act out their programming. And Doom and the hundreds of other violent video games are not the darlings of the liberals. |
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(Getting a bit off topic) This kind of stuff drives libertarians (me?) crazy. The video game is not to blame. I'm sure that a small percentage of people who have watched Sesame Street go on to become murderers as well. The logic just does not compute. Violence is ancient. I worry because: first guns... then video games... then music... what next? All are inanimate entities crafted by humans and are therefore inherently blameless. The whole absurd 'Video game-Music-Columbine' contention reminds me of back in the day... when Right-Wing Baker and Left-Wing Gore teamed up to waste taxpayer money to put musicians before Congress. This, of course is nothing new, before that it was the concern that the (mostly African-American) Blues musicians were corrupting the white middle-class youths with their devil music and bestowing upon them 'carnal urges'  (LMMFAO, as if they didn't have any). I wish politicians would focus more on the real issues like biology, psychology, and sociology. Surely we will find more Columbine answers there, rather than looking toward art as the scapegoat.
If, as the left wingers contend, art (media) infects our brain so as to cause us to act anti-socially
or
as the right wingers contend, art (media) infects our brain so as to cause us to act anti-morally
then,
my friends, we are already DOOMed for self destruction. Either put me in a plastic bubble or insert the 666 computer chip in my brain right now. Art simply is not that powerful. Art is not a 'cause' or an 'influence', it is a 'symptom' or a 'reaction'. No, I don't need to be protected from art for my own good. Personal responsibility is the key. I wish more politicians understood that. How much ($$$) is the U.S. Constitution on sale for?
LOL, one of my favorites is this tongue-in-cheek tune (We Hate Everyone) by Type O Negative:
"We don't care what you think
Lies and slander in vain try to shame us
Riots, protests, violence just makes us famous
TV interviews, free publicity
Increase record sales dramatically"
When we as a nation try to outlaw satire (it's been tried before), we are in deep shit.
Personally, I have no desire to tame all of the 'animal in me'. Life is 'warts and all'. Reminds me of that movie... what's it called?... I think... Demolition Man (?).
--- Esteban,... the anti-social, anti-moral, anti-biotic eater (ugh), anti-everything (LMMFAO), 666 computer chip wearing, evil twin alter ego of Steve... from the Bizarro World. Just kidding... kinda. Ahhh, there's nothing like good ole devil music.
Up the horns! (LMAO)
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Prense
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Re: Why People Fear Guns (Anothe Non CH but excell
« Reply #22 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 6:48pm » |
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Interesting article...makes me want to go buy a new gun.
Chris
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Re: Ramblings of a Madman (Esteban)
« Reply #23 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 6:50pm » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 6:45pm, eyes_afire wrote:| first guns... then video games... then music... what next? |
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...cell phones
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jonny
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Re: Ramblings of a Madman (Esteban)
« Reply #24 on: Jan 5th, 2004, 6:51pm » |
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on Jan 5th, 2004, 6:45pm, eyes_afire wrote: Ahhh, there's nothing like good ole devil music.
Up the horns! (LMAO) |
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And my favorite line from Type O (Live)
"Thanks for the memories you FATASS BITCH"
LMMFAO, Steve
...........jonny
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