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   Author  Topic: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD  (Read 4450 times)
pam s
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Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« on: Dec 21st, 2005, 11:01pm »
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I read someone's comment about the alleged "paranoia" induced by alternative treatments (although I've never heard anyone reprt any psychic effects at all with RC seeds).  It's important to realize that Imitrex excacerbates, if not causes, panic attacks and obsessive compulsive disorder. The most terrifying hours of my life occurred during a panic attack (I don't have panic disorder) after six weeks of constant trex use -- yet another reason I'll never use it again. Here's some research:
 
Eur Neuropsychopharmacol. 2001 Apr;11(2):169-72.      
 
Sumatriptan, 5-HT(1D) receptors and obsessive-compulsive disorder.
 
Koran LM, Pallanti S, Quercioli L.
 
Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, Stanford Medical Center, Stanford, CA, USA. lkoran@stanford.edu
 
BACKGROUND: After considering the effects of 5-HT receptor agonists with different binding profiles on the symptoms of obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD), Zohar and Kindler hypothesized that the 5-HT(1D) receptor was implicated in this disorder's pathophysiology. METHODS: We explored the 5-HT(1D) hypothesis in a 5-day, random, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of oral sumatriptan 100 mg/day in medication-free adults with OCD. We hypothesized that sumatriptan, a 5-HT(1D) agonist, would diminish 5-HT release, thereby worsening OCD symptoms. We further hypothesized that by beginning to desensitize 5-HT(1D) receptors, sumatriptan pretreatment would promote a faster response or an increased likelihood of response to subsequent treatment with a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor. RESULTS: The five sumatriptan subjects' OCD symptom worsening, as measured by the Yale-Brown scale ( upward arrow 17.6% (S.D. 14.6)), was significant when compared to the slight symptom decrease in the five placebo subjects ( downward arrow 5.2% (S.D. 4.9), P<0.015).
 
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Eur Neuropsychopharmacol. 2005 May;15(3):279-82.  
 
Anxiogenic effects of Sumatriptan in panic disorder: a double-blind, placebo-controlled study.
 
Amital D, Fostick L, Sasson Y, Kindler S, Amital H, Zohar J.
 
Department of Psychiatry, Chaim Sheba Medical Center, Tel-Hashomer, Israel.
 
BACKGROUND: Several lines of evidence point to serotonergic abnormalities in patients with panic disorder (PD). Our goal was to further examine central serotonergic function in panic patients using autonomic and subjective responses to the postsynaptic serotonin 5-HT1D receptor agonist Sumatriptan. METHOD: Using a double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled design, we assessed autonomic and subjective responses to oral Sumatriptan (100 mg) and placebo in 15 patients with PD, free of medication. Subjective responses were measured using the Hamilton Anxiety Rating Scale (HAM-A), National Institute of Mental Health Anxiety Scale (NIMHA), a modified version of the Panic Symptom Inventory (PI), Hamilton Depression Rating Scale (HAM-D), and Montgomery-Asberg Depression Rating Scale (MADRS). RESULTS: PD patients exhibited significantly enhanced autonomic and subjective responses following challenge with Sumatriptan. We observed an increased pulse rate and augmentation of various parameters measured on different anxiety scales. A constant inclination of aggravation of the measured parameters was detected during the hour post challenge. CONCLUSION: Oral administration of Sumatriptan, a 5-HT1D agonist, has been associated with an anxiogenic effect in PD patients.
 
++++++++++++++
Loi V, Lai M, Pisano MR, Del Zompo M.      
      
 Sumatriptan and panic-like symptoms.
Am J Psychiatry. 1996 Nov;153(11):1505. No abstract available.  
PMID: 8890694 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
« Last Edit: Dec 21st, 2005, 11:04pm by pam s » IP Logged

Pam

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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #1 on: Dec 22nd, 2005, 2:05am »
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Pam
 
From what I have been reading most of the drugs and herbs we take for clusters as a whole can get pretty scary if we dont know ourselves and do our homework. Especially when it comes to our own natural chemical reactions (serotinin and the like).
 
As you point out I think we all should be aware of these potential reactions including those that use the seeds. At the very least if uncomfortable, at least be comfortable with the providing doctors on prescription meds.
 
I also feel that the natural seeds are far less scarier than most of the lab created meds but again the potential for reaction with combining the seeds, prescribed meds and our own makeup is still there.
« Last Edit: Dec 22nd, 2005, 2:08am by MJ » IP Logged

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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #2 on: Dec 22nd, 2005, 7:35am »
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The only time I panic is when I dont have a cabinet full of those nice little trex boxes stacked up in there.
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pam s
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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #3 on: Dec 22nd, 2005, 10:09am »
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on Dec 22nd, 2005, 7:35am, chewy wrote:
The only time I panic is when I dont have a cabinet full of those nice little trex boxes stacked up in there.

 
I only had this reaction -- hours of the starkest terror -- after injecting (partial doses of) trex many times a day for six weeks.  I have no doubt, after reading the literature, that the trex exacerbated the CH frequency and episode duration. For me, trex has joined prednisone as the only two things worse than having CH's. I'm glad it is working for you.  
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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #4 on: Dec 22nd, 2005, 9:24pm »
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Neither of those studies says that Imitrex causes painic disorder or OCD, just that it makes the symptoms worse in those who already have OCD-if that's not you, you needn't worry.
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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #5 on: Dec 23rd, 2005, 2:44am »
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on Dec 22nd, 2005, 9:24pm, CHTom wrote:
Neither of those studies says that Imitrex causes painic disorder or OCD, just that it makes the symptoms worse in those who already have OCD-if that's not you, you needn't worry.

 
Hmmm...that's an interesting statement. Psychedelics aren't blamed for "causing" psychological problems either but there are warnings that they "can" make existing conditions worse.
That is used though to condemn their use in cluster patients. What happens if someone with psychological problems gets ahold of them?
 
The UK banned shrooms because they were shown to increase blood pressure.
Imitrex on the other hand, also increases blood pressure and other cardiovascular problems (several of which "only" caused a few deaths each, in trials)
 
http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/sumatsub_wcp.htm
 
If you read the precautions on Imitrex, I don't see anything about warnings not to use them if you suffer from OCD or panic attacks. Why is that? Makes the market smaller?  
 
I don't blame people for using Imitrex and I don't judge them in any way for using it. When it came out, it was hailed as a life saver and I believe, rightfully so. I have no doubt that it has saved more lives than it has caused the deaths of others. I still believe it to be a huge breakthrough in headache treatment of all types for which it works. It has changed the lives of millions of people. It is not though, without some serious side effects for some people. When people began dropping dead from it, they made some adjustments. They began telling people that had cardiovascular problems not to use it. Some deaths still occured so they suggested people take their first shot in the presence of a doctor. They didnt use even these deaths, to halt research or keep it off the market.  
 
OTOH, it just irks me to no end that psilocybin and LSA are not judged by the same standards.
Why isn't Imitrex banned, or why was it even approved in the first place, when studies and clinical trials showed many of the same side effects as psychedelics, affecting the same neurological and cardiovascular processes, and often in a more dramatic fashion?
 
One reason may be that even with it's drawbacks, it is still safer than some of the meds it replaced. It was more effective also. It has replaced most of the ergotamines that had been used for years, and caused some major health problems for those that needed to use them. For the most part: Sansert is no longer causing people's soft tissue organs to turn to stone. Other ergotamine based compounds are no longer turning people's toes black from gangriene. Other people have been able to stop using massive amounts of addictive pain killers.
So, even ignoring the money invloved, it appears to me that Imitrex passed the test by being more effective and safer than the previous treatments.
 
Hopefully one day, we will be allowed the same opportunities. Allow us to prove psychedelics are safer overall and more effective, overall. And when it's proven, allow them onto the market.
 
Maybe Imitrex or other currently available prescription drugs have made your life 80% better and you're happy with that. Are you happy enough with current cluster treatments....if your children get clusters? 10% of them are likely going to get them at some point. Are you happy with current cluster treatments and content enough with them to allow them to be the only choices one of your cluster-buds kids, or grandkids have?
 
If not, support Cluster Headache research!!
 
Bobw
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pam s
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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #6 on: Dec 23rd, 2005, 8:13pm »
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on Dec 22nd, 2005, 9:24pm, CHTom wrote:
Neither of those studies says that Imitrex causes painic disorder or OCD, just that it makes the symptoms worse in those who already have OCD-if that's not you, you needn't worry.

 
 
Absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence. Smiley  I didn't see any studies done on people who did not already have a disorder (the last one listed had no abstract attached), so no conclusions can be drawn about what it does to "normal" people who take it over an extended period: one cannot conclude that if you don't already have a condition you are not vulnerable. My case is anecdotal, but it convinced me!
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Re: Imitrex, Panic, & OCD
« Reply #7 on: Dec 25th, 2005, 12:56am »
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2005 Jul-Aug;26(4):464-6. Links  
 
 
A case of myocardial infarction with sumatriptan use.
 
Erbilen E, Ozhan H, Akdemir R, Yazici M.
 
Department of Cardiology, Faculty of Medicine, Abant Izzet Baysal University Duzce, Kardiyoloji Klinigi, Konuralp, Duzce, 81620, Turkey, ozhanhakan@yahoo.com.
 
Sumatriptan is widely used in the treatment of acute attacks of cluster headache. It is a serotonin-1 (5HT-1) agonist. Several studies have reported an association between sumatriptan use and myocardial infarction, possibly due to the generalized vasoconstrictive nature of this agent. We report a 16-year-old male patient presenting with acute inferior myocardial infarction after sumatriptan use without any known risk factors of coronary artery disease.
 
PMID: 16374699 [PubMed - in process]  
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"Nothing is so firmly believed as what we least know."
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