Hi all,
I know we have several firearm users here.  I need some advice on what to get.  I currently have only one, it's a Walther PPK 6+1 380.  I do like this gun, however, I'd like something that throws a bigger piece of lead.  I'm not sure if I will keep it or trade it in on something new.

I need 2 guns.  I carry one with me in my laptop bag.  I'd like to get a semi-auto but i am not sure what to get, and I would like to have rather large clips - like 12 rounds or so.  What are some good options for brands and what is a good caliber size?

I also would like to get one for home.  I think probably a 357mag for it's simplicity and stopping power.  Those shells are rated highest among all tested ammo for stopping a threat in 1 shot.  
Any thoughts on a 357 vs a 38special for home?  Any particular ones you like?

Thanks all.
B$

Desert eagle 50 cal for home and MP30 for the bag.....
And a plasma rifle 50 watt range for the truck, and ect…. ;D 8-)

Semi-auto?  Maybe a Glock model 23 in .40 cal.  Extremely reliable and durable.  I've taken a Glock around the range a couple of times, and it's a very sweet weapon.  Here are the specs:

13 rounds, 6.85" in length, 5.00" high, 1.18" in diameter.        Around 5.5 lbs.

The model 22 carries 15 rounds, but it's a little bigger and heavier.

For home defense, where portability is not an issue, it's hard to top the Remington 870 pump shotgun.  It's got more stopping power than a pistol, and--unlike a .357--it won't shoot through walls into the house next door.

JMO, FWIW.  

Best,

George        

I like the way you think JawGee.  I was just looking at this 870 tactical.  I would like to get this with another pistol grip for the pump and a light attached to the top.  I keep a flashlight in my carry bag, but with the 870 i would need both hands on the weapon. 
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Have you ever used anything from ParaUSA?  I have been looking at those too.  Here is a nice 40cal in nickel:
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and here is a nice 9mm.  
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There is something very wrong with the people and the world when not only do you need a gun but carry one around in your lap top case. Who you going to shoot the bloody tea lady at work!!!!!!!!!!

How can the madness of massacres be stopped when its okay for every one to carry a gun.   Violence  breeds violence, Madness breeds madness where is the sanity in this world

I have been to the states once or twice and never felt the need to carry a gun, or felt I was at threat.  There may be morons in your country as there are in all countrys who feel the need to shot people , but I am sure that most people most of the time do not need a gun with them to get through the day.


What the hell would happen if every one carried guns and you all wavied them about.  I dread to think.

As for the photos of the killing tools being ooohd and ahhhhrd over - well its just bloody wrong, you just as well  should have posted photos of the damage these things inflict.

Now you can all shoot me down because I disagree, lucky for me I am out of range of the real bullets.

Tanya, as a woman who has guns in her home I do understand what you're saying, but me having guns isn't going to change the violence committed by people who don't care about the law. JMO

Tanya, I'll second Mel's post. I have all kinds of guns around my house, but they're for hunting (for meat for the freezer - we eat what we kill or we kill animals like coyotes that threaten us).

I have a pistol that's still in the box it came in about 40 years ago that I love dearly and shoot rarely.

I do agree with you on the carrying of weapons. I think we've become paranoid, but people over here have gotten "mean" (just watch the news). My son was held up at gunpoint at a red light. Scared him to the point that he now carries a loaded gun in his truck. Sad state of affairs, but that's just human nature - protect yourself at all costs.

Me, I figure I have CH - what sob in their right mind would want to take me on?

Hugs BD (who doesn't have a Need to carry a gun but loves to shoot them)

 If you are looking for a big pistol the Desert Eagle 50cal,  its a cannon.
 I perfer my Glock 9mm its fairly light, holds a shit load of rounds,  acurate and stopping power well you have extra rounds shoot um a couple more times [smiley=bigguns.gif].  You can buy different 9mm ammo I have some hallow points that will stop about anything thats not all coked up,  I think there called Sliver Bear.
 You cant go wrong with a shot gun in the house.

            Phil 8-)

Brian,
I have a S&W snub nose 38 with Pachmayr Grips and I shoot 80 grain Glaser safety slugs and I can promise you that those slugs have plenty of stopping power.  And you wouldn't run the risk of the bullet competely penetrating and exiting your assailant (it's a fragmentation bullet).  

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Jimbo has a 357 and a 40 caliber and I think he's looking to by a 9 mm Glock.

Are you going to put your weapons in a gun safe or with a lock.  Has your daughter been around guns and would KNOW NOT to touch them for any reason?

I second Mel here.  Not only do we ahve guns now, I have always been around guns.  I started shooting rifles with my daddy when I was just about 4-5 years old.  When Jimbo gets his ducks in a row, going with him to take the course and apply for a concealed weapons permit.  Like a deputy up here used to say, if more women carried guns and were proficient in their use, there would be a great decrease in the violent crime rate against women.

BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 1:17am:

Hi all, I know we have several firearm users here.  I need some advice on what to get.  I currently have only one, it's a Walther PPK 6+1 380.  I do like this gun, however, I'd like something that throws a bigger piece of lead.  I'm not sure if I will keep it or trade it in on something new.

Hi Brian,
A few thoughts (from one Jag lover to another 8-)).
I sure wouldn't trade in the PPK (or any other gun) at this point.  If anything approaching the rumored tax increases on guns passes, it'll be worth a couple thousand bucks within a few months.  Hmmm... sounds like a liberal elitist plot to restrict gun ownership to elite rich folks!


Quote:

...I'd like to get a semi-auto but i am not sure what to get, and I would like to have rather large clips - like 12 rounds or so.  What are some good options for brands and what is a good caliber size?

I've always been a fan of the ol' .45 ACP, but I'm impressed with the .40 S&W too.  I have a couple of .45's now, but I'm looking real hard at both the Springfield XD in .45 (capacity of 15), and the XDM in .40 (capacity of 17).


Quote:

I also would like to get one for home.  I think probably a 357mag for it's simplicity and stopping power...  Any thoughts on a 357 vs a 38special for home?  Any particular ones you like?

I bought my wife a 4-inch EAA .357 for the nightstand.  VERY reasonably priced.  She is very sensitive to recoil & muzzle-blast, so it's loaded with .38+P JHP's.  When we're out at our rural property, it doubles as a great snake gun with .38 shotshells.

BTW, I wouldn't put too much stock in the published "one-shot stopping power" figures.  The methodology of their study was pretty flawed.  That's pretty well demonstrated by the fact that they claim a 125 grain .357 outperforms a 240 grain .44 mag.  They also rated .45's with old data using mostly FMJ ball ammo, compared with high-tech expanding HP's in the .357's and other calibers.  Personally, I'll take a .45 over a .357 any day.  Read a lot, and take your pick! ;)

Regards,
Jim

mummymac wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 2:40am:

There is something very wrong with the people and the world when not only do you need a gun but carry one around in your lap top case. Who you going to shoot the bloody tea lady at work!!!!!!!!!! How can the madness of massacres be stopped when its okay for every one to carry a gun.   Violence  breeds violence, Madness breeds madness where is the sanity in this world I have been to the states once or twice and never felt the need to carry a gun, or felt I was at threat.  There may be morons in your country as there are in all countrys who feel the need to shot people , but I am sure that most people most of the time do not need a gun with them to get through the day. What the hell would happen if every one carried guns and you all wavied them about.  I dread to think. As for the photos of the killing tools being ooohd and ahhhhrd over - well its just bloody wrong, you just as well  should have posted photos of the damage these things inflict. Now you can all shoot me down because I disagree, lucky for me I am out of range of the real bullets.

Different cultures, Tanya.  

When guns are ubiquitous--whether handguns or long guns--it doesn't necessarily follow that violence increases.  

The state where I live--Idaho--certainly has one of the highest levels of gun ownership in the US.  The number of people walking around armed, legally, with concealed carry permits is extremely high.  

At the same time, we have one of the lowest rates of violent crimes of any state.  I'm willing to bet that that the rate would compare favorably to the UK or anywhere else.  I warrant you'd be pretty darn safe here.  

There are lots of factors at play in firearms violence, only one of which is the availability of firearms.  

As for myself, well--I don't carry a firearm on a daily basis.  Don't feel like I really need one, and carrying one is a PITA.  I know about them--sure--for a lot of reasons.  And I've been around them all my life.  

Certainly not trying to throw rocks your way, Tanya--just trying to give a bit of insight into how complex our relationship with firearms is here.  There's not simply a straightforward 1/1 relationship between the availability of firearms and gun violence.

All the best,

George    

mummymac wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 2:40am:

There is something very wrong with the people and the world when not only do you need a gun but carry one around in your lap top case. Who you going to shoot the bloody tea lady at work!!!!!!!!!! How can the madness of massacres be stopped when its okay for every one to carry a gun.   Violence  breeds violence, Madness breeds madness where is the sanity in this world I have been to the states once or twice and never felt the need to carry a gun, or felt I was at threat.  There may be morons in your country as there are in all countrys who feel the need to shot people , but I am sure that most people most of the time do not need a gun with them to get through the day. What the hell would happen if every one carried guns and you all wavied them about.  I dread to think. As for the photos of the killing tools being ooohd and ahhhhrd over - well its just bloody wrong, you just as well  should have posted photos of the damage these things inflict. Now you can all shoot me down because I disagree, lucky for me I am out of range of the real bullets.

I understand how you feel, Doll.  Unfortunately, we live in a day where protection isnt going to come in the way of a patrol car.  I travel for work all day and go visit business owners at their office or home.  Sometimes I am in the deep woods where I dont even have cell phone service.
I have had a gun in my house for about 10 years.  I have never had the need to use it, although the ex-wife did.  Someone tried to break into our house while she was here and I was not.  After a few minutes of trying to kick the door in, the door failed and the person came in.  

So let me ask you.  If there is someone in your house who has stated they want to harm you, what action would you take to protect yourself?

And also, I feel that some of these massacres would have ended earlier if civilians had guns.  The way it is now, if a gunman comes into a shopping mall, he can keep killing until he is out of ammo.  If responsible people carried protection, they can stop the threat and save lives.

I do not have a gun safe now, which is why i have not gotten a revolver.  Dianan doesnt have access to my 380, and even if she did, there is no way she can put one in the chamber.  The action is too hard to pull back.

BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 1:17am:

Walther PPK 6+1 380.  I do like this gun, however, I'd like something that throws a bigger piece of lead.

About a 100 gr. softpoint in that one.




George wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 1:40am:

unlike a .357--it won't shoot through walls into the house next door.

George makes a good consideration here when it comes to high velocity loads, and house protection is short range anyway, getting in line again as a one-hander if need be, less recoil is good.  

The lower velocity 38 Special kicks up the grain to 158, not bad.  As a kid reading about them, the 38 used to have a 200 gr. called the Super Policeman or Highway Patrol, great stopper but required at least a 4"-5" barrel.  

Shooting in the dark with a handgun it's possible to flashblind yourself, what can help is closing one and alternating eyes so each recovers.  
With the Remington pump, it can pretty much be a one-shot deal, depending on the kind of load spread for collateral damage.

I'll second the motion on the Glock .40. I only own two handguns, (3 but I don't count the old 1911 grandpa gave me, it stays in the safe. Too old to shoot I think!) They are both Glock .40's. I carry the model 22 at work, it's a big framed gun but very comfortable to shoot. I'm in law enforcement so I have the 15 round mags, not sure what your states laws are like for the higher capacity mags, in California only LE can get the high capacity mags.

Off duty I carry the "baby Glock" model 27, 9 round mag with one in chamber for 10. Identical to the big one, just smaller.

I like the simplicity of the Glock, no single/double action issues, no safety to consider. Very easy to strip and clean. All the reasons my department adopted it.

I've been in law enforcement 29 years I have this to say to the sheep who think owning guns increases crime. Mexico has the toughest gun laws IN THE WORLD. No one can own a gun, you go to prison for possesion of a single round of ammunition. yeah, it's working real well at preventing crime down there! ;)

Guiseppi

Mossberg 590 for the house. In the middle of the night, half asleep one doesn't need to be concerned with aiming. Just pointing in the general direct of the disturbance is good enough. Plus, the sound of jacking a shell in the chamber is enough to make most home invaders flee with out firing a shot. Less mess that way.  ;)

B

I grew up around guns of all kinds. I no longer have one as my seizures have changed and I have no idea what might happen. I never had one for protection. I feel that they are overrated for that purpose. Nevertheless, guns are fun but it would be nice if everybody that had them were like the board members. I know a few people that I wish didn't have one.

It's impossible to ban them here, not that I would. It's too bad that everyone that has one, isn't an NRA member. They are the safest.  

The culture has changed a bit.  My mother shot skeet, my grandmother had a .32 of some kind in her dresser. We had dozens of rifles an shotguns and a 450 acre camp to use them.

Pistol shooting is kinda fun though. Then there is Dick Cheney: START PRINTPAGEMultimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to or END PRINTPAGESTART PRINTPAGEMultimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to or END PRINTPAGE

Charlie

No matter how you feel about gun ownership, I think it is very sad that people feel a need to carry weapons and/or have them in their home.

With that said, once all my kids have had a gun safety course and been out with grandpa to learn how to properly use guns (and go hunting too), I think I would consider a gun for my home.  I doubt I would ever own one (except for hunting, maybe) but I will assess the situation and decide then.

Never owned a gun....but I sure love visiting my American friends and using theirs...great adrenalin rush!

Racer1_NC wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 11:59am:

Mossberg 590 for the house. In the middle of the night, half asleep one doesn't need to be concerned with aiming. Just pointing in the general direct of the disturbance is good enough. Plus, the sound of jacking a shell in the chamber is enough to make most home invaders flee with out firing a shot. Less mess that way.  ;) B

         If ya do hafta shoot ya got half the remodel done.


                     potter

Racer1_NC wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 11:59am:

Mossberg 590 for the house. In the middle of the night, half asleep one doesn't need to be concerned with aiming. Just pointing in the general direct of the disturbance is good enough. Plus, the sound of jacking a shell in the chamber is enough to make most home invaders flee with out firing a shot. Less mess that way.  ;) B

Yeah, I am a firm beliver in do not pull out anyting you can't swallow. Meaning, if the perp gets it from you be prepared to eat it.
I loaded my own .12 Ga shells for my Winchester Model 12. I found that BB's would be most effective at a short range and do not have the capacity to leave the house like a .357 [also own one] or a 9mm. Always keep in mind down range effects of your missed shot.
My warning to anyone is the sound of the round going in the chamber. The next sound you will hear comes with smoke.
TomM

     I keep an old Colt Colteer single shot .22 around for killin stuff that needs killin, If you are a responsible person and feel the need to own a handgun then more power to ya. I'm not. I have absolutely no conscience when it comes to killing.  In the last ten years I have had two occasions where someone needed killed and thank god I didn't have a weapon handy.  I would have caused my family a lot of grief.  I whacked them with a baseball bat and called the cops.  Notice the order.

                  Potter

Well, if you opt for a revolver, don't go for the .454 Casull.

I took one of those hand-cannons around at the range one day about a year ago, and it's a real hog-leg.  Weighs nine pounds.  Very impressive noise-maker, even if it isn't practical for anything.  Plus, who can afford the ammunition?  

Might be appropriate if you have any cave bears or sabertooth tigers in the neighborhood.  I can't see any use for it, except for Pleistocene megafauna.   ;)

Best,

George

 

Potter wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 12:31pm:

If ya do hafta shoot ya got half the remodel done.                      potter

Potter, you kill me (figuratively) ;D

Add; I have a 1911 for home and it will stop em and drop em at 25 yards. A 357 is only going to go right through them unless you have commandos with body armor coming at ya! ;)

I have a S&W snub 38.....pocket design.  I always carried it and still do sometimes but not everywhere like before.  It's a pull the trigger and shoot....no worry about jamming up.  It sleeps in my nightstand drawer every night... :)

There are shotguns on every level in the house and they stay loaded unless there are children visiting.  Then they are unloaded and locked away.  The shotguns would be my first choice in case of a  B & E. ;)

Jacks 8-)

wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 1:01pm:

Potter wrote on Dec 1st, 2008 at 12:31pm: Potter, you kill me (figuratively) ;D Add; I have a 1911 for home and it will stop em and drop em at 25 yards. A 357 is only going to go right through them unless you have commandos with body armor coming at ya! ;)

The model 1911 Colt is my favorite since that was my side arm when boarding vessels in my Coast Guard days.
It thows out a lot of lead to knock a person down. I have my .357 loaded with wad cutters which I drilled out to make them semi hollow points.


Jackie wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 1:25pm:

The shotguns would be my first choice in case of a  B & E. ;) Jacks 8-)

Can't beat the sound a jacking a round in the chamber of a pump shotgun. You also do not need to aim as much and can shoot from the hip. I was actually trained how to do that.

Plaxico Buress of the NY Giants knows alot about handguns.

zwibbs-Scott wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 2:17pm:

Plaxico Buress of the NY Giants knows alot about handguns.

It would appear that he doesn't know as much as he should....

Wow, ya'll have some big firepower.  

All I want to get is a .22 Ruger, lol.

Tom,

I was taught to hip shoot too.  A friend from my gun club was really good at it.  He taught me how to shoot skeet targets from the hip.  It took some practice but I got pretty good at it.  It was fun to mess around with after a hard day of competition.

Jacks 8-)

Can't offer any suggestions on modern handguns because I’m another 12 gauge user, both are Winchester 101 over-under.

I've been told that my thinking is faulty, but my first shell is similar to the Tri-Dent rubber pellet load as a less lethal warning shot. Courts have ruled heavily in favor of folks who use less lethal means as a first deterrent. It only takes s plit second to pull the trigger twice if you want to.

My shotguns are for powdering clay – at least I like to pretend I can. I’ll guarantee you that it would be hilarious to watch me try to hit a clay target from the hip  ;D

Marc

Why do you like the over-under rather than the side by side?

Brian, if you like the look of the Para's, they make a double-action in .45 ACP.  Looks good, but I've never tried one out.

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You'll note there's also a compact version.

Best,

George

I searched and could not find the article but when the FBI test fired autos to destruction, I believe the S&W 10 was their favorite but the 1911 fired 1000 rounds even after the disconnector broke and they bypassed it (remove it and installed a stronger spring in the slide to prevent chain fire). It never stopped firing and they gave up. It defiantly showed its reliability and that’s why they still sell them 97 years from inception. ;)

Add; 13 round clips are for barn stormers! If I need more than two tries on a bad day, it would mean I'm running away. :D

Rolo. 8-)

BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 3:58pm:

Why do you like the over-under rather than the side by side?

No reason, just the way it started. The first was gift from a friend and the second was a deal I couldn't pass up. Either will perform well in the right hands.

I'm a skeet shooter, S&W Auto 1000.  I also shoot holes in paper targets with a S&W 622.  I agree with Potter, the baseball bat makes a good deterrant.

Ray

I agree with the rule that nothing beats a short shotgun for home defense.

A 5 year old possesses the skill to hit someone with it at household range, so even if you got eye-boogers going on from being woke at 3:32 am you still can feel pretty good about your odds.

Ansd then there is the variable lethality of the weapon. If you got other rooms occupied and collateral damage is a concern this feature will beat the hand gun "hands" down.

Any experienced criminal will instantly flee upon hearing the "chich-chick" pump sound.
The best home-defense weapon is one you never need to fire.

wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 4:37pm:

If I need more than two tries on a bad day, it would mean I'm running away. :D Rolo. 8-)

I hear that.  Used to be you couldn't get more than 7 per clip in Oregon, or maybe it was 10, i cant remember.  My client said to me 'if you haven't stopped a threat with 7 rounds, 15 isn't gonna help you'.  Since he was retired PD, I figured he must be right.
;)

Racer1_NC wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 11:59am:

Plus, the sound of jacking a shell in the chamber is enough to make most home invaders flee with out firing a shot. Less mess that way.  ;)

Quote:

Any experienced criminal will instantly flee upon hearing the "chich-chick" pump sound. The best home-defense weapon is one you never need to fire.

Quote:

Add; 13 round clips are for barn stormers! If I need more than two tries on a bad day, it would mean I'm running away.

Quote:

Add; I have a 1911 for home and it will stop em and drop em at 25 yards. A 357 is only going to go right through them unless you have commandos with body armor coming at ya!

Life is not a video game. Have any of you cowboys actually taken a life? You seem to think there is humor in it. I, personally am stunned by your comments. :(

Maybe it’s a man thing but if you lived a 100 years ago and were hungry or had invaders at your door, you would understand… 8-)

wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 7:34pm:

Maybe it’s a man thing but if you lived a 100 years ago and were hungry or had invaders at your door, you would understand… 8-)

Priceless :)

I use to be of the mindset that if you found yourself in a bad situation, having a gun would only enhance the chances of being shot.  Having served on a federal grand jury for a year of Fridays changed my thinking. NOLA rife with thuggery.

These days you don't stand a chance. Don't count on mercy from a bad guy. They shoot you for bragging rights. Killing you is nothing but a dead witness.

I use to have a Remington 870 pump.  Gave it to a friend who hunts regular.  I'm looking to get a new one and also shopping for a hand gun presently. Thanks for the tips.

Here's to praying we never have to use it.

Steve G

KJ,

I'm not one of the people you quoted, but I will comment.

No, I have never killed a person, but I have seen lots of death up close and personal. At 55 years old I have spent enough time looking inward to truly know myself. I'm a Dad of 5 daughters and 5 Grandkids. I would be happy to look you in the eye and tell you that I have no question that I could live with myself if I had to do it to protect those precious lives. Sometimes rabid animals have to die. That's just how it is.

Respectfully,
Marc

KJ wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 7:40pm:

wrote on Dec 1st, 2008 at 7:34pm: Maybe it’s a man thing but if you lived a 100 years ago and were hungry or had invaders at your door, you would understand… 8-) Priceless :)

Priceless no, necessity yes! Every citizen who has not abused the privilege to own has the right to defend themselves! Until they change the bill of rights, it is useless to begrudge us our right to bear arms and I’m sticking with it! :)

I should add here that anyone who's new to firearms and is thinking of acquiring one really ought to take a comprehensive firearms course that includes gun safety, self-defense, and lots and lots of range time with a certified instructor.  The range time is very, very important--and you should continue to practice regularly.

The self-defense portion should include a shoot/don't shoot segment.  

Most states that have concealed carry laws require these for licensure, but even if a person is not going to apply for concealed carry, it behooves them to be properly trained.

Okay--lecture complete...   ;)

Best,

George

I have a lot of guns.

But I prefer to throw a" job application" at the perp. They will run like hell most of the time! :D

Break into my house and you'll find out what is waiting on the other side of the door ;)

Someone bring up a link to the Charlie Daniels song "Simple Man"

That's what I'm talking about 8-)

Jimmers

Since to the causal observer all the quote's in KJ's post belong to me I'll answer, but only to mine.

I think if you will read my statement that you quoted, I specificly state that the mere sound of a shell being chambered would be enough to cause most home invaders to flee. That would be my preference.

In answer to your direct question, no, I have not been forced to take another's life. I don't even like to hunt. That being said, as Marc as stated far better than I could ever hope to, if faced with a situation that caused me either to act or witness my family being harmed by a criminal, I would act. If that means chambering a round, fine. If that means having to fire in self defense or in defense of my family, I would do so without hesitation.

If the above statements qualify me as a "cowboy", then I guess that's what I am.

Bill

George wrote on Dec 1^st, 2008 at 8:13pm:

I should add here that anyone who's new to firearms and is thinking of acquiring one really ought to take a comprehensive firearms course that includes gun safety, self-defense, and lots and lots of range time with a certified instructor.  The range time is very, very important--and you should continue to practice regularly. The self-defense portion should include a shoot/don't shoot segment.   Most states that have concealed carry laws require these for licensure, but even if a person is not going to apply for concealed carry, it behooves them to be properly trained. Okay--lecture complete...   ;) Best, George

Very true.  I took a private course with another retired cop for my CCP.  A large portion of the time was spent discussing how NOT to pull a gun, and to get the hell out of harm's way.  

You guys mean that someone has to show me how to use it? I guess that’s why I’m still here…. Just kidding!! It is a decision I would not take lightly (about .27 sec), and that I would want to be in my advantage or I would run with the cell in hand. I have two little ones in the house and the last thing I would do is a Wyatt Earp. I do prescribe to the BB bat deterant, and the guns are always locked up.

Rolo :)

Cowboy Bill, eh?  Kinda has a nice ring to it.  ;)

I wish the people here who have had experience with guns lived closer so I could get some pointers from you as I have been thinking about getting a gun.  Never thought I would ever want one but times are changing and the crime that was in the inner city is branching out to the suburbs.

I've been mugged before and although I was lucky to have escaped with bruises and cuts, it was one heck of a scary event.

A few summers ago, a guy who was posing as a student selling magazines came to my door and if it wasn't for my Doberman, Deeogee I am sure he would have tried to make his way into the house.

After three times of nicely telling him that I wasn't interested in buying anything, he turned to walk away, pulled a sharp object out of his pocket, started throwing the F word around and was going to key my Jeep.  Deeogee began to bark at him and he left but only walked down the street, sat on a rock and stared at my house for a while.  I called John and the police and have thankfully not seen him again.

Last summer, another guy was roaming the neighborhood claiming to be a handy man.  I was attempting to run an errand and as I was about to walk out the door, he appeared out of nowhere.  I went back in the house, closed and locked the screen door and told him that I was not interested.  He then grabbed the handle to the screen door while asking if he could come in to see my dogs.  Deeogee came to my rescue once again.

I would hate the thought of taking another person's life but if it came down to mine or theirs the decision would not be a hard one to make.

Baseball bats are good if you are the same size as your attacker but if you're not, what the hell are you supposed to do?  If you come into my house to harm me should I not be able to protect myself?





   

For a hand gun choice I prefer the .45 ACP to the .357 Mag.  the .45 was developed during the Philipine uprising by the Moros because the .38 that was the official sidearm of the U S Army was not strong enough to knock down an attacker with one shot.  The .45 Colt solved that problem.  The .357 tends to be to high a velocity round to have the knock down power of the .45.  

For home usage, the 12 guage does make a great deterrent as was mentioned.  It is a little hard to use a long gun in a confined space though.

Tanya,  I understand you don't have the same mentality toward firearms in the UK that has grown up with us in the States.  Just because we want to arm ourselves for self protection does not denote bloodthirstiness.  I know that is what the media portrays, but it does not hold uo.  There are several good studies that have shown that areas that have concealed carry permits readily accessible to citizens have a proportionally lower crime rate than do areas that do not allow concealed carry.  Washington DC, New York City, Chicago, and LA all have rather restrictive laws concerning gun ownership and usage, and they have MUCH higher crime rates than do much of the rest of the country.  I personally carried a .38 special on my person when running a gas station several years ago, and it stopped an attempted robbery just because the other person saw it in my hand and didn't like the odds.  I did not have to fire the weapon, but I would have if I had to.  It would have been the choice of which one of us went home that night.  

Jerry

Right now, we all have the right to be armed.  That automatically means that (even) stupid people will own guns.  That doesn't mean all people who own guns are stupid.

edited to add, I meant all in the US have the right to be armed.  There are reasonable limitations (no felons, etc) but normal law-abiding citizens have the right to be armed.  Thank God we were armed when we needed to be, and trained, and ready to act.

For the record, I prefer my Heckler & Koch USP 40, but my wife is much more comfortable with her Glock .40.

Just so I wouldn't be on a list later, I no longer have my 15 round clips, but 10 rounds is fine.  It just means more reloading at the range.  I think the extra capacity is nice at the range, but in real life I would hope to God I never needed to fire that many rounds.

Hey Beeyuulll, save a horse...

;D ;D

What about children?

I know about guns - I grew up around them, grew up in the worst neighborhood in NY.  Crystal is there now living with her father, most people know them, and she still carries a taser gun and pepper spray.

Do your kids know where these guns are in the house?  BMonee, you mentioned you have one in your briefcase.  Does your daughter know it's there?  

Kids are curious, and teenagers especially. What are the safety measures you use to avoid your kids finding and using the guns?

Langa

All it takes in this country is to start a gun thread!  :o  8-)

For you furriners.....rifles and shotguns....can be found at K-Mart. They are everywhere.
Now if you want, I used to know a guy....years ago...that was  offered interesting stuff from car trunks and shopping bags at flea markets. It's takes real work to avoid this kind of thing if you do military or collectible shows here.

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Langa wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 8:49am:

What about children?

I don't think I'd shoot any children.  Unless they were bad.

:P

But seriously, I keep my guns locked up at all times.  For accessability, I keep one loaded weapon in a wall safe with a fingerprint reader.  In about a second it can be opened and the gun is in my hands.  Sounds crazy, I know, but it came in handy already when Jen found an intruder IN OUR HOUSE.  She was smart and immediatly opened the safe and grabbed the gun.  The dude was damn lucky to not get shot.  She held him there at gunpoint until the police arrived.  My guns are safe from the children, and not so locked up that they are useless in an emergency.

We were seriously considering purchasing a winter home in the southern USA but this thread has us seriously rethinking...hmmmmn

Paul

wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 12:16pm:

Langa wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 8:49am: What about children?   The dude was damn lucky to not get shot.  She held him there at gunpoint until the police arrived.

I am willing to bet she was shaking as much as the perp.

MITYRARE wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 12:27pm:

We were seriously considering purchasing a winter home in the southern USA but this thread has us seriously rethinking...hmmmmn Paul

Yup, that's how I make all of my decisions in life.  It's really, really dangerous here - anywhere you go in the US, you just are not safe. ;D

TomM wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 12:28pm:

wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 12:16pm: Langa wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 8:49am: What about children?   The dude was damn lucky to not get shot.  She held him there at gunpoint until the police arrived.   I am willing to bet she was shaking as much as the perp.

And that's why he probably didn't move a muscle.

I've been on the business end of a barrel with a shaking person holding the trigger. It was only for few seconds, but I was sure I was going to get shot.

Marc wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 1:06pm:

MITYRARE wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 12:27pm: We were seriously considering purchasing a winter home in the southern USA but this thread has us seriously rethinking...hmmmmn Paul Yup, that's how I make all of my decisions in life.  It's really, really dangerous here - anywhere you go in the US, you just are not safe. ;D

not that so much as culture shock - do that many people really carry guns with them?, in their cars?, in their night stands?...WTF
We have our fair share of crime here...but gun crime is mostly gang related, knife violence mostly ethnic...and the rest of us just duke it out with our bare hands!  - sounds to me like i could be in trouble if i am the only one with just fists at my disposal....follow my logic?

MITYRARE wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2008 at 1:18pm:

Marc wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 1:06pm: MITYRARE wrote on Dec 2nd, 2008 at 12:27pm: We were seriously considering purchasing a winter home in the southern USA but this thread has us seriously rethinking...hmmmmn Paul Yup, that's how I make all of my decisions in life.  It's really, really dangerous here - anywhere you go in the US, you just are not safe. ;D not that so much as culture shock - do that many people really carry guns with them?, in their cars?, in their night stands?...WTF We have our fair share of crime here...but gun crime is mostly gang related, knife violence mostly ethnic...and the rest of us just duke it out with our bare hands!  - sounds to me like i could be in trouble if i am the only one with just fists at my disposal....follow my logic?

Depends on where you go in the US, I suppose.  Around here, you can't spit in any direction without hitting someone who's armed.  (Come to think of it, maybe spitting's not such a good idea.)

J/K.   ;)  

Best,

George

The fist thing I say to Michel (8) every time the 22 is empty is did you clear it?
He now does it every time without prodding. When you teach them respect for weapons at a young age, it is a lesson they carry for life. My son now always says did you clear it dad? Is it safe dad? That is how we breed smart gun owners!

Rolo.. ;)

Quote:

not that so much as culture shock - do that many people really carry guns with them?, in their cars?, in their night stands?...

No.

I've sold a lot of war relics and military souvenirs. You sell CW and WWII stuff at gun shows. Most people that do gun shows don't carry guns. I don't know anyone in my area that does and western New York has a lot of gun owners.

My guess is that close to 99% of the people living in Dallas don't run around with guns either. People like to talk about being armed but you won't see people over here totin' guns.

Charlie

I have never walked around armed unless you count trips to the range.  That would be a bad idea here on the left coast.

BFG9000 ;)