My father-in-law at 75 wants to start day trading with the 20K he has liquid.

He is relying on me to set it up for him so I feel guilty already before he’s even started.
I set it all up and faxed the info today. The company told me it would take 5 days to process and he is already calling tonight chomping at the bit so to say.

His impatience is very unnerving and I somehow feel culpable in setting it up for him after my sister-in-law refused.

Some knowledgeable input on how to better deal with his eagerness to risk it all please!

Roland. [smiley=ohjez.gif]

I think your sister-in-law had the right idea.

Can't he go to someone else who is not a family member to help him? I worry that if things don't work out, the blame might be put on you with lots of problems down the road.

I just man, woman hit on sore head and say do it for dad!

That sums it up. I know all I can do is shore the levee. I just know that it’s going to bite me in the A$$. You know how you feel when you know you made an unavoidable mistake? I’m there!

Rolo.. :-/

Oh Rolo...please try try try,  to talk him out of doing this.

   I know someone who is doing this for the last year.  The man is "GLUED" to his computer...he is addicted actually.  He is also losing so much money it isn't even funny.   Can you tell him to put it in a CD or something?   Jeese..........

Plastic surgery and a move to Canada are some options. 8-)

I wish Linda, he is like a mule with blinders and thinks he sees a bushel of apples ahead!

It is truly scary even on dialup. [smiley=damncomputer.gif]

Rolo I hope you are just setting up the account for him and not doing the trading,  if youre doing the trading then its a recipe for disaster.

 Phil

Let me related my very personal experience.

My father took $130K - the proceeds from the sale of his home, and began day trading with it.  

Over the course of two years he made over ONE MILLION DOLLARS.  

And then he proceeded to LOSE IT ALL.  Yes, all of it.  Every stinking dime.  He thought it couldn't happen to him.  He "knew" when to get out . . . .he knew what he was doing . . . .yeah . .. sure . . .

When he died he was receiving $900 a month from Social Security.  Nothing else.  No savings, no rainy day fund, nothing.  Food pantries, subsidized housing, no money for anything but survival at the barest minimum.

My advise is don't get involved in it.  If he wants it so bad let him figure it out.  Don't enable him.

Quote:

If he wants it so bad let him figure it out.  Don't enable him.

Pat speaks wise words there Rolo.

I just set up the account for him and faxed the documents necessary.

I’m sure he will be calling me for help with the web page because he can’t find his crapper when it comes to the internet and links and such…

I’m not answering the phone if he calls, I’ll let the machine get it.

I just hate being sucked into crap like this, my conscience is bothering me.

I’m going to run from it the best I can and hope the shrapnel misses me…

Add; He cannot call tech support and be online at the same time so that will slow him way down!

Yep Pat.   That is exactly what my friend was doing...almost to the letter.


Rolo...can you maybe print these reponses out for him and hopefully make a point?  Like I said this friend of mine was almost to the point of having no life.  He didn't eat properly.  If he woke up in the middle of the night...he'd spend another 2 hours trading...etc.

He made some money and then lose it all back.   Gamblers do the exact same thing.  This friend of mine also ....LOST EVERYTHING.   Including his wife (who divorced him ) and his childrens respect.

I have no idea of where he is now..probably at a homeless shelter or at best.. living off of friends charity who have no idea of what stupid things he's done.    :-/


Really sad.
 

Even though the account is already open, I really would try to talk him out of it unless it's "play money" he can afford to lose and this would be a form of entertainment to him.

Day trading, as already pointed out, is simply a form of gambling.  Maybe he'd have more fun taking the money, grabbing the family, and heading to Vegas together?

As in gambling, the odds are stacked against you.  It is a high-cost proposition, because you have to cover the cost of the commission and the short-term gains tax before you even break even.  So it's one thing if he views it as a form of entertainment - another thing altogether if he views it as a form of investing.  It isn't.

Actually - all you really have to do is point out how difficult professional money managers are finding it to make money in this market!

Here's something that may help you talk some sense to him:  START PRINTPAGEMultimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to or END PRINTPAGE

The North American Securities Administrators Association found that "at least" 70% of day traders lose money (and most of them "almostly certainly lose everything they invest", and only 11.5% "might" profitably trade.

If he still insists, read this for advice if he's considering paying for some type of trading system - he's got to make sure the system he's considering hasn't been censured, fined, or is under investigation for false advertising:  START PRINTPAGEMultimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to or END PRINTPAGE  

Good luck,

Laurie

wrote on Dec 3^rd, 2008 at 10:20pm:

I just set up the account for him and faxed the documents necessary. I’m sure he will be calling me for help with the web page because he can’t find his crapper when it comes to the internet and links and such… I’m not answering the phone if he calls, I’ll let the machine get it. I just hate being sucked into crap like this, my conscience is bothering me. I’m going to run from it the best I can and hope the shrapnel misses me… Add; He cannot call tech support and be online at the same time so that will slow him way down!

I got tied up on the phone and missed a bunch of posts before I hit the "post" button - but sounds like a plan!

Laurie

Oh, no.  
He's on dial up and wants to get level 2 quotes for day trading through a retail broker?  Lol
What other types of investment knowledge does he have?  Does he have any idea how stocks trade?  

Unfortunately, it's too late for you to say no.  If your father is of healthy mind, I guess you have to let him learn this lesson the hard way.  

I day traded for a while......made some money doing so, but the market then sure wasn't like it is now. I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole with your money now.

Can you say Hemhorrage?? OMG! Even if you have SOME knowledge....sheesh! That's dangerous right now!
How 'bout dirt? it's cheaper in most parts of the country now than it was 2-3 yrs ago.of course, even with that, $20 isn't a lot...BUT, it's certainly safer than stock..........
Rolo, I wish you strength-and luck!
Cathi :D

BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote on Dec 3^rd, 2008 at 11:12pm:

What other types of investment knowledge does he have?   Does he have any idea how stocks trade?   I guess you have to let him learn this lesson the hard way.

None, No, and Yes  :(

Who am I to tell him, he is an adult of sound mind (until now!) and I can only distance myself from it unfortunately. I just hate the back blast! [smiley=bomb.gif]

What pisses me off is that my sister-in-law is the dumb A$$ that planted the seed!! >:(

Thx, B$.. Rolo.. [smiley=ohjez.gif]

It's gonna be a tough road for him.  Win some, lose some.  
I used to be a SOES trader back in the day, then I went in to day trading for myself.  I did well for a couple of years, then the banking lobby got some new rules instilled so retail traders get last in line for everything.  I didn't even play that game.  I went into accounting.

This market is actually a good market for trading.  Volatility is where money is made......if you dont lose it first.

Oh, now, B..that is confidence! Why I feel all warm and fuzzy now!!!!

BTW-how are Fannie and Freddie doing?


Rolo.........B's the man when it comes to finance..........

Cathi :-*

cynjeep89 wrote on Dec 3^rd, 2008 at 8:04pm:

I think your sister-in-law had the right idea.

wrote on Dec 3^rd, 2008 at 11:25pm:

What pisses me off is that my sister-in-law is the dumb A$$ that planted the seed!! >:(

Now you know Cathi dear, the culprit and she said it was because he was yelling at her on the phone!!

Rolo.. :-*

Role reversal can be an odd thing with parents.  It's hard (but not impossible) to say "no" to them.

Print this entire thread thus far and give/send it to him.  Do NOT enable him any further or your conscience will bother you forever.


Linda

I talked to penny (sister-in-law) and found out that she was approached by the father-in-law on T-day (I just hate my 5 pm blues, and missed the conversation while on the tank) about how to set it up. She was trying to help him set the account with Zecco on the phone and told him to leave her alone if he could not listen to her and if he kept yelling at her on the phone.

Seems he had his mind on it like a brick! She and I feel it’s a mistake we will just have to live with. He will not be getting our guidance on this matter, and we are firm on that…..

Thx all!

Roland… :-/

And the phone is ringing… Here it comes… I’m not answering it… Not going to do it! Rolo...>:(

Add; He has called 4 times in 10 min..... ::)