Prednisolon DAK 25 mg  (bi kidney bark hormone) Not actually sure its translated correct  !

I tried this 2 x 25 mg in 5 days to stop a cluster period.  First time I was in a 3 months period  and the attack stopped on day 3.

Totally free for 4 month and then it came back.  on second day, I start a new 5 days treatment and it worked after 1 day, but came back after i finished the

5 days treatment.  I decide to try with another 2 x 25mg x 5 day as I was in middle of nowhere and did not bring enough Sumatriptan injections.

I stopped and its now almost 4 months ago.

It is like a miracle for me and hope it can help others as well.   I can live with my cluster and always have Sumatriptan injections with me, but when its really hard
days with  up to 6 x 5ml Sumatriptan injections (seldom)  it is really a miracle to stop the attack totally in few days.

I am new in this forum and suffered of this sh.. 30 years now, I will tell my story later on, just for now wants to share my experience with this treatment
Hope it can help other in same efficiency way as me.

(bi kidney bark hormone will usually have some side effect for long time use according my doctor, but 2x25mgx5 days is absolutely not a problem from time to time.

Good luck and remember to discuss it with your doctor first !  Feel free to drop me a line if any question.

interesting first post. you should hang out let us get to know you a little bit better. it may give you the to help out another sufferer like yourself. ;)

Klaus wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 1:55am:

Prednisolon DAK 25 mg  (bi kidney bark hormone) Not actually sure its translated correct  ! I tried this 2 x 25 mg in 5 days to stop a cluster period.  First time I was in a 3 months period  and the attack stopped on day 3. Totally free for 4 month and then it came back.  on second day, I start a new 5 days treatment and it worked after 1 day, but came back after i finished the 5 days treatment.  I decide to try with another 2 x 25mg x 5 day as I was in middle of nowhere and did not bring enough Sumatriptan injections. I stopped and its now almost 4 months ago. It is like a miracle for me and hope it can help others as well.   I can live with my cluster and always have Sumatriptan injections with me, but when its really hard days with  up to 6 x 5ml Sumatriptan injections (seldom)  it is really a miracle to stop the attack totally in few days. I am new in this forum and suffered of this sh.. 30 years now, I will tell my story later on, just for now wants to share my experience with this treatment Hope it can help other in same efficiency way as me. (bi kidney bark hormone will usually have some side effect for long time use according my doctor, but 2x25mgx5 days is absolutely not a problem from time to time. Good luck and remember to discuss it with your doctor first !  Feel free to drop me a line if any question.

Hello Klaus

I am very glad that you have found what works for you and helps you stop your attacks and thank you for taking the time to try and help others with your experience

but I am afraid I do need to add a few words of warning to your advice if others are reading it and thinking of trying what you have done as the drugs you are recommending people take are not being dosed in a way that is normal or even entirely safe I'm afraid

Prednisolone

I don't know what bi-kidney bark hormone is but Prednisolone is quite frequently used to break CH cycles. However, it is a powerful corticosteroid and should be dosed differently to the way you took it and also MUST be tapered off over time, i.e. the dose reduced gradually over a period of time NOT suddenly stopped after 5 days. The max dose recommended is usually 60mg per day (less for smaller people) reduced by 10 mg every 3 days until stopped. It shouldn't be taken long term either although I know thankfully you didn't.

Sumatriptan
6 doses a day is bad idea. It is recommended that you have no more than 2 in 24 hours and we have had some really serious incidents reported on this board when people have taken more than this and been very ill. Please don't risk it again. Most of us have done it at some time when desperate but it really can be dangerous to your heart and circulation.

This is why so many of us use 02 as our main abortive and I urge you to try it rather than using so many triptans. You can use 02 as many times as you like in 24 hours.

I hope this helps.

Do post again and tell us a bit about yourself?

Wendy the Brit

WOW! Awesome post by the pubgirl! Many use prednisone for the treatment of CH. Some like you are fortunate and a short burst will abort a cycle. I'm not as lucky as you. As long as I'm on prednisone, I'm headache free. But as soon as I go off, the beast comes back with a vengeance!  :oLong term use of prednisone isn't an option as it has some nasty side effects over a long time frame.

I use it now as a transition medication, I'll do a 10-14 day prednisone taper while I'm waiting for my prevent to kick in, for me that's lithium.

Here's hoping that Prednisone did the trick and you'll have a LONG pain free time!

Guiseppi

Hi Wendy the Brit and others with fast reply here.

I know Prednisolon never will end up on the list of health products. I know some people on daily dose of 50-60 mg for month and up to 6 months
(Not for Cluster headache) Even some as high as 80mg/day

The dose of 2x25 mg in 5 days was recommended from a professor working with Cluster patients daily.
As you mention 6 injection with imigran within 24 hrs sounds as a deadly cocktail for me as well, so it was for sure worth to try out with Prednisolon.

I have to mention I did not feel any side effect, or lets say only very small side effect.

I know about oxygen and have use it for many years. I am from Denmark but live in China for now, and the oxygen things could be a bit complicated to get here.

I am usually carefully with injections and pills, try to search all information as i guess we all are scared about long term side effects.

Back to Sumatriptan, I also know the recommended dose of 2 x 6ml /24 hrs, and its really hard to find any information about overdose and I often discuss it
with my doctor and he cant find any good explanation either as long I an fine and not feel different side effect than usual. Sumatriptan will be completely out of your body
quite fast. According the professor in cluster, its more about the risk of getting a kind of addictions, so the Sumatriptan it self will trigger the next attack.

Well, we can ask different people and we will get different answers, and will sit back with all our doubt :) we dont wanna play russian roulette, right :)

I will for sure take Prednisolon another 5 days if or when the hell comes back (i know its not if, but its legal to hope :)
After years with only short periods without CH, it feels like a miracle and I am happy a short 5 days treatment works for me, and hope so badly its only every 3-6 month i have to
repeat.

Hi Klaus

You have great English assuming it isn't your native language- puts us all to shame!!!

Pred
2 x 25mg per day should be fine- it is usually recommended at 1mg per kilo of bodyweight. It is the TAPER that matters, your body needs to adjust gently to coming off the steroids.
Do your 5 days if that is what works for you but reduce the dose each 3 days rather than just stopping.

I think it is also suggested that it shouldn't be done more than twice a year either.

Overdosing on Triptans

For obvious reasons we don't actually KNOW what the danger level is and I have never found any literature about it. The drug companies will surely play safe by saying 2 doses but I know at least two people who had some nasty side effects from 4 doses so I wouldn't risk it

Glad you are so clued up, good luck with getting the 02 in China!!!

Wendy

Thanks Wendy, sure my  tongue is Danish and my English becomes "Chinglish" here :)

Hummmm, 1mg per kilo of bodyweight, thats nice, then I can go as high as 90 mg hehe

Klaus wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 9:02am:

Thanks Wendy, sure my  tongue is Danish and my English becomes "Chinglish" here :) Hummmm, 1mg per kilo of bodyweight, thats nice, then I can go as high as 90 mg hehe

No you can't Klaus!
1mg per kilo but recommended max is 60mg even if you are a "big boy"   :-X

W

by the way, what IS bi-kidney bark hormone????

bi-kidney bark hormone, was my best attemt to translate from Danish.
     
Does "suprarenal gland hormone" give more meaning ?

It's an overall naming of these kinds of medz's (I think)

Klaus wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 9:31am:

bi-kidney bark hormone, was my best attemt to translate from Danish.       Does "suprarenal gland hormone" give more meaning ? It's an overall naming of these kinds of medz's (I think)

Corticosteroids is one word that is used that way - from the adrenal cortex or outer layer (bark).  

There may some confusion between Methyl Prednisolone and Prednisone? Very different dosages.

Quote:

but Prednisolone is quite frequently used to break CH cycles. Wendy the Brit

Is PrednisoLONE the same as predniSONE, If I am not wrong (looked it up on Merck website) and if I understand it right it is not the same…..


Quote:

Medication Safety Issues Sound-alike/look-alike issues: PrednisoLONE may be confused with predniSONE

so I am abit confused……  Wendy, are you positive about the name…..  in the UK (?)….

Michael

wildhaus wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 12:27pm:

Quote: but Prednisolone is quite frequently used to break CH cycles. Wendy the Brit Is PrednisoLONE the same as predniSONE, If I am not wrong (looked it up on Merck website) and if I understand it right it is not the same….. [quote]Medication Safety Issues Sound-alike/look-alike issues: PrednisoLONE may be confused with predniSONE

so I am abit confused……  Wendy, are you positive about the name…..  in the UK (?)….

Michael[/quote]

This Q has come up before and last time I checked (and will go and do so again!) Prednisone and Prednisolone were the same drug that had slightly differing names depending which country it was dispensed in.

methyprednisolone isn't one I know so will go and look up that one as well!

W

All that really maters Wendy is that you can not stay on prednisone indefinitely. It will eat your vertebra and cause many related problems for continual users. My uncle was on the stuff for over 20 years. He sneezed real hard one day and broke 3 vertebras.

It works great for me, and the grocery store enjoys the increased profits also. He He…

LY Wendy!

Roland. :-*

wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 2:00pm:

All that really maters Wendy is that you can not stay on prednisone indefinitely. It will eat your vertebra and cause many related problems for continual users. My uncle was on the stuff for over 20 years. He sneezed real hard one day and broke 3 vertebras. It works great for me, and the grocery store enjoys the increased profits also. He He… LY Wendy! Roland. :-*

That's because Prednisone lowers your bone desnity if used for extended periods. I had to go on calcium suppliments after I tapered off Prednisone.
TomM

WTF !  getting more and more confused now,  
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Have translated it and hope it give some sense. The dose seems really crazy high or are we really talking about same drugs ?

How come other people through a Prednisolone cure??? Due to deterioration of my headache, I've just been through a Prednisolone-kur printed by the Headache Center. It consisted of 5 days with 100 mg of Prednisolone and then I Degression with 12.5 mg per day. I had some obviously not so much energy, but I had been on a similar Prednisolone-kur same time last year, so I had some experience, and I had read the leaflet of side effects, and I also came just over a website. In other words, I believed that I had quite a grip on it. The first day went well. No headaches but plenty of sleep disorders ... no surprises here ... but on the fifth day, I began to shake hands and have a strong chest tightness ... and in the following days there came other exciting ¨ ¨ side effects such as cranial headache, fatigue and confusion. I ended up being the right pressure ... isolated me and spoke just down to the cure was over ...

May-Britt Hey!
I have several times been on Prednisone-courier, and has repeatedly had similar side effects as you note, but I have also reviewed cures almost without side effects.

The strongest side effects I had when I was reviewing a cure by 300 mg in 3 days, and decline by 60 mg of x-number of days, 50 mg, 40 mg, etc.

Not long ago I went through a cure with 1,000 mg for 3 days, and the same decline as 300 mg `s cure. Even with a dose as high as 1,000 mg a day, I had almost no side effects.

What I'm trying to say is that the next time you do not have to get the same side effects that you now have, iallefall if it works the same way with you as it did with me.

A bit confused by the translation to be honest Klaus but from your highlighted parts I would hesitantly suggest that the doses look insanely high and unnecessary. The person may have had no side effects AT THE TIME but the damage high dose or long term steroids do isn't always immediately obvious as previous posts make clear.

I would prefer to stick in my comfort zone of max 60mgs per day. I have never seen anything higher than this recommended to Ch'ers so have to stick to what I know


Wendy

Wendy, I know what you mean, and its not  I like to make experiments with doses higher than my doctor have recommended me, as it works fine for me.
You just scared me in the beginning haha, and I did some more research.
I think we all are deadly scared that the treatment helping us now, will not help the next time, and then what ? can we take more or should we look for alternatives.

I have it in same way with Imigran injections as its the only available treatment for me in the moment.
And yes, I am happy I am rid of the attach for now, and regret I bought a huge huge stock of injection (damn expensive)  I guess I have at least 200 x 6ml here.
I should open a drug store haha....

i was concerned about overdosing on the imitrex so I ended up doing the trick that is suggested, by taking the vile out of the injector cartridge and then pushing  the needle in my arm and using a q tip to push about half or sometimes just a third of the drug in.. then I could do a few of these through the day... I would imagine its differnt with everyone, as far as how much of the drug is really required to kill the pain enough to get things done,, but reducing the amount of imitrex injection works good for me, so at least I dont over do the drug...  

Oxygen didnt do much for me when I tried it, but I am going to try it again with a different mask... not giving up on the oxygen.  The CPAP machine is just working great so far...

Klaus wrote on Dec 8^th, 2008 at 9:31am:

bi-kidney bark hormone, was my best attemt to translate from Danish.       Does "suprarenal gland hormone" give more meaning ? It's an overall naming of these kinds of medz's (I think)

Hm, Maybe Adrenal is what you mean? The adrenal glands are on, or by the kidneys, so that might be where the name comes from

ETA: The adrenal gland's outer cortex is referred to as the 'bark'. More than likely it's something that effects this.

Double edit.

"The outer part (adrenal cortex) secretes many different hormones that control the use of fats, proteins and carbohydrates in the body. The cortex also secretes male sex hormones as well as mineralocorticoids that control blood pressure and the levels of salt and potassium in the body. "

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