I've seen thread after thread asking why someone is now an ex-member, , cannot post, cannot send/receive PM's, and on and on.

The rules are - if you cannot post or respond to another's post without resorting to name calling, threats, , derogatory statements, verbal abuse, then you deserve to be excommunicated from these boards., whether temporally or permanently.

These boards are not yours.  You do not own them- you have no control over them - you have no say in how they are run.

You must abide by the board rules.  If you choose to break those rules than you suffer the consequences.

It is YOUR choice.

So, either quit your askin, or quit your bitchin.

Sandy

I suspect that you missed the point of why those questions were asked.

Sandy_C wrote on Mar 11^th, 2009 at 3:06pm:

I've seen thread after thread asking why someone is now an ex-member, , cannot post, cannot send/receive PM's, and on and on. The rules are - if you cannot post or respond to another's post without resorting to name calling, threats, , derogatory statements, verbal abuse, then you deserve to be excommunicated from these boards., whether temporally or permanently. These boards are not yours.  You do not own them- you have no control over them - you have no say in how they are run. You must abide by the board rules.  If you choose to break those rules than you suffer the consequences. It is YOUR choice. So, either quit your askin, or quit your bitchin. Sandy

Sandy_C
CH.com Alumnus
***
Online

There is no such thing
as a stupid question.

If I missed a point, please tell me what it is.

As I understand the "point" is to treat everyone, including newbies, those who haven't yet been diagnosed but are searching ,those who have suffered for years but are not finding relief from their pain, those who might even be a troll, with nothing more than a just a little bit of respect.

Do you have a problem with this, because I don't.

If I missed the "point" of questions asked, please enlighten me.

Sandy

I think that some were just wondering what had happened.   That was the point.  DJ and Steph had no problem letting others know about the incidents in question.  No one was arrogant or disrespectful to them in asking.  

Using my better judgment.... I'll leave it at that. ;)

Jeannie

Sandy:  One post asked why a certain poster was locked for a comment that the questioning poster had deemed just as insulting as other posts being made that did not result in a lock.  This is a fair question for clarification purposes.  I think the question was because the infraction was borderline in that posters mind and might have wanted to be clear on the exact rules for future posting.

Just how I read it.

Jeannie wrote on Mar 11^th, 2009 at 4:09pm:

I think that some were just wondering what had happened.   That was the point.  DJ and Steph had no problem letting others know about the incidents in question. Jeannie

I will answer this one, if I may.  Not everyone has alumnus status (it's real easy though, just hit the Paypal button at the bottom of the page).  Those who don't have alumnus status cannot read DJ's explanation.  Others who had questions pm'd the mods and were directed to DJ.  That being said, if anyone has questions about missing members,problems with members, or questions about the rules, talk to the man in charge, not the lackeys/conscripts who row the boat  ;).

TBH, there are actually very few rules here, none that can't be abided by with ease.  I've been a member of communities that would make DJ's rules look like kiddygardner rules and there were no exceptions to those rules and most of them were the type that if you violated them once, you were gone, no ifs, ands or buts.  you were not only deleted, your IP was banned (in cases where there was a static IP).

Carolyn

Sandy_C wrote on Mar 11^th, 2009 at 3:26pm:

If I missed a point, please tell me what it is. As I understand the "point" is to treat everyone, including newbies, those who haven't yet been diagnosed but are searching ,those who have suffered for years but are not finding relief from their pain, those who might even be a troll, with nothing more than a just a little bit of respect. Do you have a problem with this, because I don't. If I missed the "point" of questions asked, please enlighten me. Sandy

Sandy,

All of us know about the rules, they are posted very clearly and prominently in the top section of every board.  They have been discussed many times in several threads also.

When a person becomes an Ex-member, some people simply wonder what happened.

Did they get angry or frustrated over something that I/we said?  Were they booted out for repeated bad conduct?  Based on the close contact and sharing that occurs in this board, I don’t feel that the question is out of line. Nor do I feel that it indicates having a problem with the rules.

Sometime the point of a question is just to get an answer.

Marc

Quote:

These boards are not yours.  You do not own them- you have no control over them - you have no say in how they are run. You must abide by the board rules.  If you choose to break those rules than you suffer the consequences. It is YOUR choice. So, either quit your askin, or quit your bitchin.

Kinda contradictory don't ya think?

I just don't get why some make this a such a big secret.  I am not surprised Jonny is gone; I was actually wondering how long it would be, not so long ago.  Polly Pocket on lock down is different; she seems to be pleasant in all her posts.  I had to look...The only thing I could find is boxers/butt hole.  It looked like she let Brew push her button to me, it did not look that bad.  There must be more to it than that?

It does not piss me off, as some have stated, it just comes across as silly to me when mods jump in and direct people to PM DJ like it is taboo to discuss it openly.  Why do people have to jump through all the hoops to understand the ins and outs of DJ's new standard of conduct.  Does it have to be such a game...  I do not get why everybody gets their panties in a bunch when it comes to discussing how someone may or may not have crossed the lines of decency.  

Looking at the how the other thread ended I wonder if maybe some of these people should not just go back to being mean again.  They are starting to lose their minds with all the senseless blather.  I have seen kindergartners behave more mature on the playground.  

It is like this, I am not here all the time, like some.  I will come and go as I please, looking for the new and latest way to deal with my CH.  I might even offer advice to newbies now and again.  If DJ is trying to make this a friendlier atmosphere that is great...  But, does everyone really have to secretly PM DJ every time someone has a question like this?  Does DJ have the time to play twenty questions all the time?  It seems really silly to have to do this.  Instead of mods typing nonsense on a thread, why don't they grow up, and send their own PMs to get things under control instead of escalating things?  I mean you are moderaters, right?  You can do things on your own.  DJ trust you enough to be mods, then be mods...

Thomas    

icedragon- mods are only here to alert DJ to what he might deem to be against his rules.  We lock threads and DJ reviews them and HE is the one to decide what is to be done.

We arn't the freakin peace keepers, that is not in our job description.  Keeping the peace is up to everyone here by how they interact with one another.

The rest of the world defines moderator differently.  Your title might be misleading if this is the case.  When reciting lyrics to children's songs is your solution to trying to calm the situation, maybe you should be called "hall monitors."  But then again, if all you are allowed to do is lock threads...It should be revisited.

Moderator

The moderators (short singular form: "mod") are users (or employees) of the forum which are granted access to the posts and threads of all members for the purpose of moderating discussion (similar to arbitration) and also keeping the forum clean (neutralising spam and spambots etc). Because they have access to all posts and threads in their area of responsibility, it is common for a knowledgeable and trustworthy member to be promoted to moderator for such a task. Moderators also answer users' concerns about the forum, general questions, as well as responding to specific complaints.[17] Moderators themselves may have ranks: some may be given mod privilege over only a particular topic or section, while others (called 'global' or 'super') may be allowed access anywhere. Common privileges of moderators include: deleting, merging, moving, and splitting of posts and threads; closing, renaming, stickying of threads; banning, unbanning, warning the members; or adding, editing, removing the polls of threads.[18]

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Thomas- is that definition listed on this website?

Let me add to this as well Thomas....

as much as we love to play Twenty Questions with everyone here, quite frankly it's really no ones damn business if someone leaves on our terms.  We don't air out people's dirty laundry.  DJ has told the Moderators that if people are so inquisitive to ask WTF is going on, then we feel that information should come from the people that hit the "delete" button.  Now, if they choose to leave on their own, that's one thing, most will broadcast it for the world to see as to why they hate this place or why they need to step away for awhile, not a big deal.

The Moderators know what they have been asked to do, and they do "moderate" like they are supposed to.  They are trusted with being able to make the decison to lock down a thread when they feel it crosses the line, this, Thomas, is what they were "hired" to do.  They aren't "hired" to keep the peace around here, people should be responsible enough to control their statements as to not offend, and choose to play nice in the sandbox.  It's that simple.  

It's not taboo to talk about it, but like I said, when it comes down to a decision from DJ or myself to delete someone's profile, we feel that if you have questions concerning it, why not go to the source, which is us?

icedragon:  Moderators do a lot of different things on different forums.  Here they so as Mel said they do.  This forum tends to be less policed than other forums and the admins tend to share more of their decisions with the general forum than in other forums.

Dont get caught up in semantics.  All the admins want here is for people to show common courtesy to others.  The moderators here alert the admins when there is a question and the admins make their decisions.

As for the thread you are referring to, I found it a bit annoying but I also understood they were trying to hijack a thread that was beating a dead horse.  They were doing it as posters, not as moderators.  Had they wished to end the thread, they could have locked the thread, but the moderators here don't do that.

As for PollyPocket, you should probably ask her yourself.  I have and it helped answer my questions.

I would like to add a thought to this thread as well.  There is nothing done 'secretly';  if, as moderators, we advise people to PM DJ, then it's because that is what we were instructed to do BY DJ.  Case in point, is with Pollypocket, what happened there, happened between her and DJ privately, and we are not privy to the details of the information.  What the mods know is that Jen and DJ had communications, and DJ and her agreed that a locked profile a few days was an appropriate action;  beyond that, we can't answer anything else.

Additionally, as the purpose of the general guidelines, and having moderators to begin with - Steph and DJ are trying to return the atmosphere of ch.com to a place where anyone can come in and ask questions without fear of being attacked.  The site had been in a steady degradation and it needed to stop the downward spiral and get back to being a place of safety and support.  

The very nature of the friendships and relationships that form bonds on ch.com comes from a very unique set of circumstances, that in truth, can only be recognized and understood by other sufferers and supporters.  That atmosphere requires a certain level of trust, since most of us wouldn't dream of talking about our affliction, and certainly not displaying it, with people in our lives that don't suffer - they simply can't understand the way another sufferer or supporter can.  To maintain those very precious and valuable bonds, it is reasonable to strive to provide an atmosphere that has respect, integrity and trust at it's core.

In the past, when things got out of hand, DJ has pulled the plug on the site, removing it from access for a period of time.  I fear that if things were to continue in a negative spiral, the plug won't get pulled for a time, it will get pulled permanently;  and we will have no say in it whatsoever, since DJ and Steph own the site and have the right and the choice to handle it as they see fit.  With DJ about to retire from the Air Force in a very uncertain economy, I would imagine he has no desire to add further stress to his life with concerns on paying for the board and it's upkeep (remember, every time we have an added feature on the board, DJ has to pay to have the YaBB owners code a special script) for the purpose of people to sit around and bad mouth or attack each other.  

My opinion then, and it is just that, is that if the forum can't operate under the guidelines he's set forth, then we all stand the very real possibility to lose the forum permanently.  Personally, when I think about the ramifications of that event, I will do anything I can to ensure I act within the guidelines as well as to help ensure the site does as well, based on the criteria DJ set out for the mods.  While we will never all agree on any action that occurs, DJ has final say on if he wants a particular tone, type of thread or anything else, and he isn't required to give us any information at all.  It's out of common courtesy and respect for the members that he tries to keep everyone informed.  I would hate to lose this place because there are a few who don't like the rules.  Those few who can't or won't understand or accept the guidelines, could threaten the entire forum for the rest who do adhere to the guidelines.

Now, before I find out I inadvertently upset or offended someone, please know this post is not intended to be directed at or single out any specific person.  It is a general response to the information.

Cat

Thank you Cat.  Well said.  


This is like the 483rd time we've been over this and the TOS is stickied at the top of every forum.    
Can we lock this thread and everyone STFU about it now?  

Honestly............

Sandy_C wrote on Mar 11^th, 2009 at 3:06pm:

I've seen thread after thread asking why someone is now an ex-member, , cannot post, cannot send/receive PM's, and on and on. The rules are - if you cannot post or respond to another's post without resorting to name calling, threats, , derogatory statements, verbal abuse, then you deserve to be excommunicated from these boards., whether temporally or permanently. These boards are not yours.  You do not own them- you have no control over them - you have no say in how they are run. You must abide by the board rules.  If you choose to break those rules than you suffer the consequences. It is YOUR choice. So, either quit your askin, or quit your bitchin. Sandy

Excommunication?  There is a chance reading this stuff and it's hurting him,  just quit.  Ever notice he has posted here like a million years and poured his heart and soul into this 'family'.   Realize that boundaries and putting on the breaks aren't as easy for every person.    Yes I know what happened and it was really bad.  But if you take to heart stuff he does after knowing what he is like all these years,  you are crazy.   Censure has taken place, but this kind of talk is just cruel.

Quote:

ClusterHeadaches.com is going to live by a new set of "standards" that involve integrity and respect.  These standards have been added to the registration agreement so every new member who joins from now on will know what the expectations are when they create their profile. This message board is not a democracy, at best it is a benevolent dictatorship.  As such, users of this site will be held to a prominent standard of integrity and respect. Debate is welcome (and encouraged), but attack ideas and opinions; not personalities.  Note that putting an "in my opinion" type of qualifier on a violating statement does not change the fact that the statement violates these standards. Personal attacks or threats against other board members will NOT be tolerated. Racist, sexist, Anti-Semitic remarks, or hate speech will not be allowed. Calling a member 'troll' or using 'troll' or similar emoticons is considered a personal attack.  Abuse of the Private Message (PM) privileges, harassment, stalking, etc... will not be tolerated. As a general guideline, the first instance of a member violating these standards will result in a “lock down” of one week during which the member will not be allowed to post on the message board or send/receive PM’s.  A second instance will result in a “lock down” of one month.  A third instance will result in immediate and permanent banning. In order to protect and preserve the overall health and well-being of the site, the owners/administrators reserve the right to remove any post or user from our community at our sole discretion and without explanation. YOUR FREEDOM TO LEAVE – All visitors to the ClusterHeadaches.com Message Board are here voluntarily.  Nobody is forcing you to post here.  The Administrators and Moderators try their best to be fair, and to make the ClusterHeadaches.com Message Board a welcoming place to participate in a lively exchange of ideas about living life with cluster headaches.  If you don't like the Members/Moderators/Administrators of the ClusterHeadaches.com Message Board, or the way the ClusterHeadaches.com Message Board is run, then we strongly suggest that you exercise your freedom to leave.

Thank you Steph, for the definition for your "hired" moderators.  I seem to be having trouble locating it anywhere else on the board.  I have to ask, do you consider your hired moderators to be held to a higher standard of conduct?  I mean, you do want them to lead by example, Yes?  Being that everyone, including trolls, should be treated with respect, you don't think that anyone should be using antagonizing banter to egg someone on before locking a thread do you?  Even though debate is welcome and encouraged, I am not looking to debate anything.  I only want to know what is and is not acceptable on your web site.  I mean, Can I be locked for telling someone to pull their boxers out of their butthole?  I would ask PollyPocket, but she is locked...I can't send her a PM.  I don't really care to know what Jonny did, or anyone else's dirty laundry for that matter, I just want to know what I should expect to be okay to say and what not to say is all.  

I get why there is a new set of Standards.  I have seen plenty of attacks on people in my short time here.  Some even by people who are now moderators, which is a good thing...  They get it.  Change is good, I just want to understand the change in your view.  You have to keep in mind communication is receiver based.  People will sometimes interpret things the way they want to hear them and not as you meant.  I am simply asking for clarification.  I feel that discussing this openly is okay being we are not discussing other people's dirty laundry.  If you feel this is the wrong way to go about it, then let me know.  I am only here, like most everyone else, to deal with a demon, and to learn from others.  I am not here to make enemies, if others are tired of talking about it, then don't open the thread.

Thomas

wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 5:43pm:

I only want to know what is and is not acceptable on your web site...  I just want to know what I should expect to be okay to say and what not to say is all.

It's not as difficult as you are making it out to be Thomas.  It's actually very simple.  All we're looking for here is a little respect.

It would be incredibly stupid of me to try and list every single word, phrase, or statement that I will allow or not allow, which it sounds like you are asking me to do.  Be respectful, that's it.

You don't know that whole story on what happened with the Polly situation.  There was more to it and that's all anyone else needs to know.  She and I talked worked it out and all is good.

Believe it or not, I'm not out to "lock" everyone, it sucks to have to do that.  But I'll be damned if this place turns back into the free-for-all it once was and I'll do everything in my power to ensure that doesn't happen.

[smiley=twocents.gif]

DJ

Quote:

...I just want to know what I should expect to be okay to say and what not to say is all.  People will sometimes interpret things the way they want to hear them and not as you meant.  I am simply asking for clarification. Thomas

It is impossible to define specifically. It's kinda like the definition of pornography....you know it when you see it. If you wan't absolutes, go to the math channel.  ;)

It must be noted that this in MY OPINION and mine alone.

BTW....isn'ti it about time for Free (the) Bird? 8-)

Short and to the point . Would you ask a total stranger how much money he makes?   It's not anyones business how much money DJ makes or loses on Clusterheadaches.com.  
 As far as dirty laundry and what was said by someone that got them locked or banned that ain't our business either.

        Kinder gentler Potter

Thomas, one thing I would like to address, and keep in mind this is only my perspective based on my own involvement.

The thread that ended up with tongue twisters in it, was not an attempt by myself at least, and I don't think the other mods either, to make fun of, or degrade, or discount anything discussed.  That particular thread was quickly showing that some of the specifics questions that were asked would never get a satisfactory answer.  The bantering and tongue twisting was an attempt to lighten the mood of the thread and draw people into an atmosphere of brevity.

It wasn't my intent to disregard what was going on.  I was just trying to lighten the mood of the thread, as it was going downhill fast and people were getting upset.

As a moderator, sometimes our course of action is no action.  There are times when it's better for us to remove ourselves from the discussion for the very reason you suggested, to lead by example.  There was no malice intended with the tongue twisters;  it was an attempt to redirect the thread and try to avoid any further escalation of the situation.

If you have ideas or suggestions about how we might do things differently, or better, then please feel free to email or PM me, any of the other mods, or DJ and Steph.  We are all open to, and welcome, input from the members on suggestions for solutions to make the changes more cohesive, however, it is much easier to deal with it on a one to one basis, and that's the reason I suggest PM'ing or emailing the mods or admins.

Hope that helps a bit.

Cat

ETA:  As far as any specifics on what can or can't be said, if you take an opposing, or even defensive view of a post or a thread, then by all means respond to it.  Doing so in a manner that addresses the thought/opinion/ideal rather than the person themselves, will, in general, prevent the 'personal attack' interpretation.  As long as debates, discussions and comments are made with respect and integrity, then the poster should be fairly safe with what they say.  It's an effort to take the focus of the people, and put it back to the ideas.  I can tell my kids that they did something stupid, and that allows me to make sure they understand *they* aren't stupid, just their actions.  Just a personal example is all that is.

Tommy,
    You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches.

As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-)

KJ wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:15pm:

BTW....isn'ti it about time for Free (the) Bird? 8-)

Which 'bird' are you referring to KJ?  I'm not sure I know who you mean.

Cat

I found the rhyme thread insulting.  Kind of like a little kid sticking his fingers in his ears and saying la-la-la-la-la.

I think George performed his job perfectly.  He thought the thread was getting out of hand so he locked it.  Much more paletable than the la-la-la-la approach.

Duly noted Bob.  My self, it wasn't a lalalala issue, it was an attempt to make people smile and lighten the atmosphere.  I will in future, keep your concerns in mind and will do my best to avoid anything that could be construed as lalalala approach.

My apologies.

Cat

I just thought it important to note an historic event.

Global warming MUST be all a lie because hell just froze over and I agreed with BobP.

:D
Bobw
Tough job to change the moral landscape of any society. DJ, Steph and all the Mods have my respect. (not knowing of course if they WANT to associate themselves with it or not LOL)

Bob P wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:32pm:

I found the rhyme thread insulting.  Kind of like a little kid sticking his fingers in his ears and saying la-la-la-la-la. I think George performed his job perfectly.  He thought the thread was getting out of hand so he locked it.  Much more paletable than the la-la-la-la approach.

I am sorry you feel I insulted you Bob.  Definately wasn't my intention.

Jimi wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:25pm:

Tommy,     You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches. As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-)

Personally I think thats uncalled for.

Thomas has been asking questions in a respectful way. He might have a lot of questions but I would not call them "whinings" .

To say that he has a personality disorder is not fair.

Pinkfloyd wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 7:28pm:

Tough job to change the moral landscape of any society. DJ, Steph and all the Mods have my respect. not knowing of course if they WANT to associate themselves with it or not LOL

I have no problem associating myself with it...none at all and thank you.

catlind wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:28pm:

KJ wrote on Mar 12th, 2009 at 6:15pm: BTW....isn'ti it about time for Free (the) Bird? 8-) Which 'bird' are you referring to KJ?  I'm not sure I know who you mean. Cat

This Bird....is free now......woohoo!

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I got a cracker!

wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 7:39pm:

Jimi wrote on Mar 12th, 2009 at 6:25pm: Tommy,     You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches. As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-) Personally I think thats uncalled for. Thomas has been asking questions in a respectful way. He might have a lot of questions but I would not call them "whinings" . To say that he has a personality disorder is not fair.

Annette, Jimi did not say he has a personality disorder.  You are splitting hairs.

[quote author=6143444D404B474F591B2A0 link=1236798397/31#31 date=1236901611]

Which 'bird' are you referring to KJ?  I'm not sure I know who you mean.

CatThis Bird....is free now......woohoo!

      START PRINTPAGEMultimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to or END PRINTPAGE

then why is that metal band still around my ankle?  ;)

wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 7:39pm:

Jimi wrote on Mar 12th, 2009 at 6:25pm: Tommy,     You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches. As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-) Personally I think thats uncalled for. Thomas has been asking questions in a respectful way. He might have a lot of questions but I would not call them "whinings" . To say that he has a personality disorder is not fair.

I read that completely differently Annette.  I didn't see where Jimi said they had a personality disorder, what I read was, if that was truly his personality, then Jimi is of the opinion there is something more going on - not necessarily personality disorder, just other issues based on Jimi's interpretation of the information and IF that is truly his personality.  As for the 'whining' and/or 'complaining' I clearly understood that Jimi was referring to the information presented and questions brought up, over a period of 3 months, not necessarily/just this particular thread or just questions asked.


Jimi wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:25pm:

Tommy,     You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches. As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-)

Since Jimi is a moderator, the best course of action to take if you believe it's uncalled for, is to PM Steph and DJ, as the other moderators don't have the authority (so to speak) to address another mod, it has to go through the admins.

If you would like, I can present it to DJ on your behalf, or you can PM him or Steph directly, whichever you are more comfortable with :)

Cat

Let's Review and end this thread:

1.  There are rules, follow them and there wont be any problems (they are listed on every forum).

2.  POLLY IS BAAAAAAAAAACK

3.  If you have a problem with a thread, let a moderator know.  If your problem is with a moderator, let DJ or Steph know.

4.  CH SUCKS

5.  Honestly, what can I say more nail on the head than CH SUCKS!!!

Good day everyone, no replies needed!

If I have misread that, then my sincere apology to Jimi.

In a way though, it sorts of demonstrate how misunderstanding can happen innocently at times. Its very easy to read something out of context and having the need to ask even more questions to clarify.

I dont think I need to "report" it to DJ or Steph. I would rather ask the person directly and get an answer from them. We are all adults here. If every time any of the moderators says something that can be interpreted in different ways and we run to DJ or Steph for an explaination, they would not have a moment's rest.

I have a suggestion though, since the bottom line is that this site is owned and run by DJ and Steph, they have the final say in whatever and however things are to be carried out  ( and I personally dont have a problem with that at all ), that it could be added to the published rules. Something along the line of " ... in certain circumstances an explaination may not be provided and DJ's decision is final "?

Like in Judge Judy  :)

That way its all in black and white so no one needs to ask again.

wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 8:18pm:

If I have misread that, then my sincere apology to Jimi. In a way though, it sorts of demonstrate how misunderstanding can happen innocently at times. Its very easy to read something out of context and having the need to ask even more questions to clarify. I dont think I need to "report" it to DJ or Steph. I would rather ask the person directly and get an answer from them. We are all adults here. If every time any of the moderators says something that can be interpreted in different ways and we run to DJ or Steph for an explaination, they would not have a moment's rest. I have a suggestion though, since the bottom line is that this site is owned and run by DJ and Steph, they have the final say in whatever and however things are to be carried out  ( and I personally dont have a problem with that at all ), that it could be added to the published rules. Something along the line of " ... in certain circumstances an explaination may not be provided and DJ's decision is final "? Like in Judge Judy  :) That way its all in black and white so no one needs to ask again.

"In order to protect and preserve the overall health and well-being of the site, the owners/administrators reserve the right to remove any post or user from our community at our sole discretion and without explanation."

This is already in the code of conduct...

NOW, can we end this thread??

It's an effort to take the focus of the people, and put it back to the ideas.  I can tell my kids that they did something stupid, and that allows me to make sure they understand *they* aren't stupid, just their actions.

Since Jimi is a moderator, the best course of action to take if you believe it's uncalled for, is to PM Steph and DJ, as the other moderators don't have the authority (so to speak) to address another mod, it has to go through the admins.

If you would like, I can present it to DJ on your behalf, or you can PM him or Steph directly, whichever you are more comfortable with



Catlind, what is all this stuff? You equate your role with your children to your role as a moderator on ch. com?

Then Annette expresses her view on a comment, and you advise her to contact the administrators or else you could? Her comment wasn't inflammatory at all...she just disagreed.

Everybody take a breath....please. :)

KJ wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 8:41pm:

It's an effort to take the focus of the people, and put it back to the ideas.  I can tell my kids that they did something stupid, and that allows me to make sure they understand *they* aren't stupid, just their actions. Since Jimi is a moderator, the best course of action to take if you believe it's uncalled for, is to PM Steph and DJ, as the other moderators don't have the authority (so to speak) to address another mod, it has to go through the admins. If you would like, I can present it to DJ on your behalf, or you can PM him or Steph directly, whichever you are more comfortable with Catlind, what is all this stuff? You equate your role with your children to your role as a moderator on ch. com? Then Annette expresses her view on a comment, and you advise her to contact the administrators or else you could? Her comment wasn't inflammatory at all...she just disagreed. Everybody take a breath....please. :)

I think cat was really trying to make the point about the difference between calling an action/idea stupid and calling a person stupid.  I dont think she was equating her role that way.

I think the mod was offering to bring her concern to DJ for her if she wished.  Read my post above.  If people have a problem with a mod, bring it to DJ.  I think she was just trying to be helpful.

YOU ARE RIGHT THOUGH.... we all need to chill out!!

LETS END THIS THREAD NOW!!!!

and get back to enjoying the board, especially since PP has returned!!!

 you  make me crazy.

     Kinder gentler potter

..... err nothing here really... just thought I'd give it one more kick... because it is not yet looking like ground meat.
:)

with warm regards,
Tony

wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 8:18pm:

that it could be added to the published rules. Something along the line of " ... in certain circumstances an explaination may not be provided and DJ's decision is final "? That way its all in black and white so no one needs to ask again.

DJ and Steph's decisions ARE final. There is no need to explain to anyone as to why anyone gets locked, or permanently banned. It's no one's business. However, if anyone feels the need to know, it has been said time and time again... send a PM to DJ. He will respond as he sees fit.


Mrs Deej wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 3:49pm:

as much as we love to play Twenty Questions with everyone here, quite frankly it's really no ones damn business if someone leaves on our terms.  We don't air out people's dirty laundry. It's that simple.   It's not taboo to talk about it, but like I said, when it comes down to a decision from DJ or myself to delete someone's profile, we feel that if you have questions concerning it, why not go to the source, which is us?

The rules have been posted by DJ. They are his rules, not OURS. They are ours to abide by. They are perfectly clear and do not need to be added to. If you feel the need to suggest additions to DJ's rules, to help you remember how to act, or not act, why not just keep in mind for yourself?

As much as we would all like to live in a perfect world, we don't. People will say things that hurt others. As has been said before, it's about self control. Having respect for the person. Saying having CH is an excuse to lose that control, and say hurtful things to other members is a bunch of crap, IMO. If you can take the time to think ahead, and type a response to someone, you must not be in the throes of CH pain.

We have our rules. If you have questions about them, then PM DJ, and he'll answer the question. Easy as pie.

Jimi wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 6:25pm:

Tommy,     You have been  "asking" for clarification every few weeks for the last 3 months or just complaining or whining. I think you are just here to stir the pot. If not, and this is truly your personality, you have more problems than clusterheadaches. As Potter says..................short and to the point..........quit whining, it doesn't become you. 8-)

Ah Jimbo,
You not sore because I compared the behavior of some of the  moderators to school children are you?  Your not attacking my character now, are you?  Can you clarify what you mean by this statement?  

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FramCire wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 8:48pm:

KJ wrote on Mar 12th, 2009 at 8:41pm: It's an effort to take the focus of the people, and put it back to the ideas.  I can tell my kids that they did something stupid, and that allows me to make sure they understand *they* aren't stupid, just their actions. Since Jimi is a moderator, the best course of action to take if you believe it's uncalled for, is to PM Steph and DJ, as the other moderators don't have the authority (so to speak) to address another mod, it has to go through the admins. If you would like, I can present it to DJ on your behalf, or you can PM him or Steph directly, whichever you are more comfortable with Catlind, what is all this stuff? You equate your role with your children to your role as a moderator on ch. com? Then Annette expresses her view on a comment, and you advise her to contact the administrators or else you could? Her comment wasn't inflammatory at all...she just disagreed. Everybody take a breath....please. :) I think cat was really trying to make the point about the difference between calling an action/idea stupid and calling a person stupid.  I dont think she was equating her role that way. I think the mod was offering to bring her concern to DJ for her if she wished.  Read my post above.  If people have a problem with a mod, bring it to DJ.  I think she was just trying to be helpful. YOU ARE RIGHT THOUGH.... we all need to chill out!! LETS END THIS THREAD NOW!!!! and get back to enjoying the board, especially since PP has returned!!!

Thanks Fram.  You are spot on.  That is exactly what I was saying.  The quotes pulled are from 2 different areas of the thread, addressing different people and their voiced concerns.  I offered Annette another option for her to present her concerns regarding Jimi's comment, nothing more, nothing less.  I saw nothing inflammatory in her comment, she voiced a concern, that she found the comment unacceptable, and I just wanted to let her know that she had the means to have those concerns addressed.

Annette, yes, when you are dealing in this particular type of communication on a forum such as this, things can easily get misunderstood.  That's why it's important to go to the source and get clarification.  The mods aren't always able to answer specific questions regarding things that DJ does.  He acts according to his standards, and as was said, he has already stated that he can and will act in a manner he deems appropriate and can do so without explanation.

My example regarding my children was just that, an example, no hidden context or meaning.  Just a means of equating a real life example to the desired actions for the community.  I, in no way took anything as inflammatory, and was simply trying to help give a further understanding.

If anyone has questions, they are free to email me, catlind@charter.net, or PM me, or of course, ask any of the mods, or DJ or Steph.

Hope this helps clear any misconceptions.

The main goal is to ensure that the boards remain a civil and respectful place without constant tension so that we don't end up facing DJ pulling the plug.  That would be a true crime and would be devastating :(

Cat

ETA:  Taking your well and wise advice now Fram

Its just not the same around here, for good or ill, the fun (or life if you prefer) has been sucked out of this place.

Mat wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 9:44pm:

Its just not the same around here, for good or ill, the fun (or life if you prefer) has been sucked out of this place.

Hey Mat,  have you ever seen a pressure cooker working?

It gets hotter and hotter, then the valve opens and all the hot air and built up steam blows out the top.

But in the end, you have the good stuff perfectly preserved.

Its like that.

Stick around for the good stuff  ;)

Jennifer wrote on Mar 12^th, 2009 at 9:52pm:

Mat wrote on Mar 12th, 2009 at 9:44pm: Its just not the same around here, for good or ill, the fun (or life if you prefer) has been sucked out of this place. Hey Mat,  have you ever seen a pressure cooker working? It gets hotter and hotter, then the valve opens and all the hot air and built up steam blows out the top. But in the end, you have the good stuff perfectly preserved. Its like that. Stick around for the good stuff  ;)

Now THEM are some wise words.

Thank you Sis for sharing that.

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Take your pick

Good words there Jen................Welcome back! :)

Well said, Jen.   :)

Good to see you back again.

Best wishes,

George

Missing feared lost!

Sanity.

Would anyone knowing the whereabouts of the aforesaid please direct it back.

Sadly missed.

Some of you will think this is beating the dead horse, but you are really gonna have to hear this out.  The more i think about this, it can all be dealt with differently.  DJ, you probably are not going to agree right away, and if it does not happen now it is going to have to happen sooner or later.  DJ needs to give the Moderators more authority, plain and simple.  As it is now everything gets diverted to DJ and Steph.  The mods have no course of action but to lock things up and divert it to DJ and Steph.   Things start to get out of control and they have to come up with their own devices to try and control the situation.  Kinda like rhyming like school children until it gets more out of control and lock it up so DJ and Steph can step in.  It is kind of like you have given them badges and no guns.  They need more.  They come across as proud and completely behind your ideas on how to make this a better board, let them help you.  Things could be so different if a mod had the authority to PM people to defuse a situation, or tell some one they are out of line before a situation escalates.  If you want to change things, I mean really change things, you are going to have to let others help you change things and not just let them baby sit the store front while you are away.  It is your call, but hows it working for you so far?  It is gonna happen sooner or later DJ.    

wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 1:40am:

Some of you will think this is beating the dead horse, but you are really gonna have to hear this out.  The more i think about this, it can all be dealt with differently.  DJ, you probably are not going to agree right away, and if it does not happen now it is going to have to happen sooner or later.  DJ needs to give the Moderators more authority, plain and simple.  As it is now everything gets diverted to DJ and Steph.  The mods have no course of action but to lock things up and divert it to DJ and Steph.   Things start to get out of control and they have to come up with their own devices to try and control the situation.  Kinda like rhyming like school children until it gets more out of control and lock it up so DJ and Steph can step in.  It is kind of like you have given them badges and no guns.  They need more.  They come across as proud and completely behind your ideas on how to make this a better board, let them help you.  Things could be so different if a mod had the authority to PM people to defuse a situation, or tell some one they are out of line before a situation escalates.  If you want to change things, I mean really change things, you are going to have to let others help you change things and not just let them baby sit the store front while you are away.  It is your call, but hows it working for you so far?  It is gonna happen sooner or later DJ.

Wow...thank you SO much for telling us how to run our own site...your suggestion has been noted!

Get a grip, grow up and let it go!

Hey he's got a point, I want a gun or I quit Stef! >:(

Joe

Guiseppi wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 2:30am:

Hey he's got a point, I want a gun or I quit Stef! >:( Joe

Geez Joe, first it was a lap dance, gave you that in St. Louis (thanks Chuck), now you want a gun...what else, a salary too?  Fuckin unbelievable!!   ::)

NEVER satisfied....

[smiley=ohjez.gif]

wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 1:40am:

It is your call, but hows it working for you so far?

It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it.

Your suggestion is noted.  Now move on.

DJ

wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 1:40am:

Some of you will think this is beating the dead horse, but you are really gonna have to hear this out.  The more i think about this, it can all be dealt with differently.  DJ, you probably are not going to agree right away, and if it does not happen now it is going to have to happen sooner or later.  DJ needs to give the Moderators more authority, plain and simple.  As it is now everything gets diverted to DJ and Steph.  The mods have no course of action but to lock things up and divert it to DJ and Steph.   Things start to get out of control and they have to come up with their own devices to try and control the situation.  Kinda like rhyming like school children until it gets more out of control and lock it up so DJ and Steph can step in.  It is kind of like you have given them badges and no guns.  They need more.  They come across as proud and completely behind your ideas on how to make this a better board, let them help you.  Things could be so different if a mod had the authority to PM people to defuse a situation, or tell some one they are out of line before a situation escalates.  If you want to change things, I mean really change things, you are going to have to let others help you change things and not just let them baby sit the store front while you are away.  It is your call, but hows it working for you so far?  It is gonna happen sooner or later DJ.

I was standing behind a couple of carpenters not so long ago when I decided to give some helpful advice,  the two old sliver pickers turned to me and the eldest said  " Son we're the ones fuckin this cat.  You're just holdin the tail. Dummy up."  I got it.

        Kinder gentler Potter

I don't care who you are........now that was funny! ;D

Thank you Deej and Steph for everything you do and go through for us.

"aintnodisco"
[smiley=wave.gif]

Potter that made this whole sorry thread worth the read.

Mine and Jimbo's old boss (surveyor) used to say pretty much the same thing, except his went like this, "I'm fucking this cat, you hold it's tail and I'll give you a spotted kitten".  Same meaning though.

Potter wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 10:50am:

I was standing behind a couple of carpenters not so long ago when I decided to give some helpful advice,  the two old sliver pickers turned to me and the eldest said  " Son we're the ones fuckin this cat.  You're just holdin the tail. Dummy up."  I got it.         Kinder gentler Potter

[smiley=crackup.gif]  [smiley=crackup.gif]  [smiley=crackup.gif]  [smiley=cowboy.gif]

A more succinct reply, I've never seen. Good one!  ;)

Damnit, Potter....I just spit Diet Coke all over my computer.   ;D

Thanks for the big laugh!!!

Thanks Potter for this mental picture now stuck in my head !   :P

I feel sorry for the cat !

DJ wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 6:58am:

wrote on Mar 13th, 2009 at 1:40am: It is your call, but hows it working for you so far? It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it. DJ

DJ, be careful....some mod might lock you for that one. Like the old Andy Griffith episode...."Citizens arrest, citizens arrest"! ;D

Not a chance KJ, not a chance. ;)

Isn't it better to have an open forum on a site like this which is specific to a cause as long as it's not dictatorial.
Otherwise Hail Hitler

karma wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 3:32pm:

"aintnodisco" [smiley=wave.gif] Potter that made this whole sorry thread worth the read.

 Thanks.  
Kinder gentler Potter

Quote:

Isn't it better to have an open forum on a site like this which is specific to a cause as long as it's not dictatorial.

Yep.

DJ wrote on Mar 13^th, 2009 at 6:58am:

It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it. Your suggestion is noted.  Now move on. DJ

Obviously, my suggestion has made you sore.  It now appears that some are given the right to disguise their belittling comments; and that is okay with you because you are bothered by my suggestion.  Comes across like a double standard of conduct, and the way this thread is continuing on with  the disrespectful comments it is as if you are condoning it.  If so, then so be it, just be up front about it.  Sure, I could have sent you a PM, but then, you could have done so as well. Just as well, you could send Rollo an e-mail.  

Now you can let this bother you, go ahead and reduce what I have said, allow the kids to be clowns, and keep holding Potter's tail.  You can lock the thread, lock me and call me out like you are doing Rollo, take your football and go home if you must...  I am only one member with an opinion, but I am willing to bet there are others with similar opinions.  I hope that after you cool down, you are able to really understand what I am saying and re-evaluate your standards.  I wish you only the best of success.

Now, let's move on and let the clowns continue with their yucks...

wrote on Mar 14^th, 2009 at 2:55pm:

DJ wrote on Mar 13th, 2009 at 6:58am: It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it. Your suggestion is noted.  Now move on. DJ Obviously, my suggestion has made you sore.  It now appears that some are given the right to disguise their belittling comments; and that is okay with you because you are bothered by my suggestion.  Comes across like a double standard of conduct, and the way this thread is continuing on with  the disrespectful comments it is as if you are condoning it.  If so, then so be it, just be up front about it.  Sure, I could have sent you a PM, but then, you could have done so as well. Just as well, you could send Rollo an e-mail.   Now you can let this bother you, go ahead and reduce what I have said, allow the kids to be clowns, and keep holding Potter's tail.  You can lock the thread, lock me and call me out like you are doing Rollo, take your football and go home if you must...  I am only one member with an opinion, but I am willing to bet there are others with similar opinions.  I hope that after you cool down, you are able to really understand what I am saying and re-evaluate your standards.  I wish you only the best of success. Now, let's move on and let the clowns continue with their yucks...

  You got the analogy wrong,  I'm also holding the tail,  while you keep stepping on your dick. Don't it start hurtin after awhile?

         Kinder gentler Potter

I think someone forgot the unwritten rule.

Thou shalt not piss off the owners of the website.

If ya don't like this one, get yer own.

wrote on Mar 14^th, 2009 at 2:55pm:

DJ wrote on Mar 13th, 2009 at 6:58am: It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it. Your suggestion is noted.  Now move on. DJ Obviously, my suggestion has made you sore.  It now appears that some are given the right to disguise their belittling comments; and that is okay with you because you are bothered by my suggestion.  Comes across like a double standard of conduct, and the way this thread is continuing on with  the disrespectful comments it is as if you are condoning it.  If so, then so be it, just be up front about it.  Sure, I could have sent you a PM, but then, you could have done so as well. Just as well, you could send Rollo an e-mail.   Now you can let this bother you, go ahead and reduce what I have said, allow the kids to be clowns, and keep holding Potter's tail.  You can lock the thread, lock me and call me out like you are doing Rollo, take your football and go home if you must...  I am only one member with an opinion, but I am willing to bet there are others with similar opinions.  I hope that after you cool down, you are able to really understand what I am saying and re-evaluate your standards.  I wish you only the best of success. Now, let's move on and let the clowns continue with their yucks...

Thomas,

In all honesty, what is your point?  You tell DJ to PM you, well I PMed you and you didn't choose to reply.  You keep not only beating a dead horse, but you aren't making any relevant points.  People who made the posts you were upset about told you they didn't mean to disrespect you.  Is that not enough?

Follow the rules and all will be fine.  It doesn't matter who enforces the rules or how it is done.

Now, you have said your peace.  Can you stop beating the horse and grab a paddle and start rowing?

Remember, its not just DJs ball, its his field too.

wrote on Mar 14^th, 2009 at 2:55pm:

DJ wrote on Mar 13th, 2009 at 6:58am: It seems to be working fairly well Thomas.  All except for you who won't shut the fuck up about it. Your suggestion is noted.  Now move on. DJ Obviously, my suggestion has made you sore.  It now appears that some are given the right to disguise their belittling comments; and that is okay with you because you are bothered by my suggestion.  Comes across like a double standard of conduct, and the way this thread is continuing on with  the disrespectful comments it is as if you are condoning it.  If so, then so be it, just be up front about it.  Sure, I could have sent you a PM, but then, you could have done so as well. Just as well, you could send Rollo an e-mail.   Now you can let this bother you, go ahead and reduce what I have said, allow the kids to be clowns, and keep holding Potter's tail.  You can lock the thread, lock me and call me out like you are doing Rollo, take your football and go home if you must...  I am only one member with an opinion, but I am willing to bet there are others with similar opinions.  I hope that after you cool down, you are able to really understand what I am saying and re-evaluate your standards.  I wish you only the best of success. Now, let's move on and let the clowns continue with their yucks...

Listen Thomas... I'm tired of you telling me how to run my site.  I told you I got your point and you keep pushing.  If you don't like the decisions I make, LEAVE!  It's not like you're "bringing anything to the table" here anyway.  I just read through your last 50 posts and all you do is argue.  No good suggestions to help with clusters, nothing.  You're nothing but a trouble maker in my eyes and I'm done bantering with you.

DJ