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Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Cluster Headache Specific >> Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1296366531 Message started by billy_the_kid on Jan 30th, 2011 at 12:48am |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by George on Jan 30th, 2011 at 9:31am |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Guiseppi on Jan 30th, 2011 at 10:02am
That's interesting stuff. I see you have a nose for research Billy, I for one appreciate those on the site, like yourself, who are always poking and prodding!
Joe |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Brew on Jan 30th, 2011 at 10:11am Quote:
Of course, Joe loves his regular visits to the proctologist and urologist, too. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Guiseppi on Jan 30th, 2011 at 10:15am Brew wrote on Jan 30th, 2011 at 10:11am:
Thas messed up.... ;D Joe |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by billy_the_kid on Jan 30th, 2011 at 2:09pm
I just hope one day someone can add all this up and figure out maybe a cure or a very good iron clad preventative........
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Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by chris420 on Jan 30th, 2011 at 2:28pm
so there is a gene that causes people to be addicts?
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Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Brew on Jan 30th, 2011 at 3:33pm ChefChris wrote on Jan 30th, 2011 at 2:28pm:
In my mind, there is a good possibility that the same set of genetic properties that predisposes us to develop CH also has something to do with addiction. Look at how many CH'ers are smokers, and then look at how many have quit without any impact on their CH. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Guiseppi on Jan 30th, 2011 at 4:49pm ChefChris wrote on Jan 30th, 2011 at 2:28pm:
It makes sense...it would explain why some people can recreationaly do drugs while others use something once, and they're chemically dependant on the stuff for life. A complex thing the brain is...... Joe |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Samiam on Jan 30th, 2011 at 8:35pm
I always found it to be strange was that no one in my family that I know of has cluster headaches. I also never smoked. I drink occasionally. I can go months without a drink or glass of wine (I just lose my taste for it). I have brown eyes and I'm a female. I know for a fact that I don't have an addictive personality. I have had a ton of hard cord pain killers over the years to get me though these prior to having someone that knew what they were doing and once the pain stopped I stopped using the pills and they sat in the cabinet for years until the cluster would start again.
Now my bio father fit every trait. He was an alcoholic, smoked heavy, blue eyes, rugged skin, Male. Now I often wonder could I have inherited the cluster's due to half his DNA. Sami |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by wimsey1 on Jan 31st, 2011 at 8:04am Samiam wrote on Jan 30th, 2011 at 8:35pm:
In the discussion of addiction, let's not forget that substance addiction is not the only culprit on the table. Process addiction (which while not universally accepted by the medical community is well acknowledged in the recovery community) also exists. Process addictions include overeating anything, porn, sex, hoarding, overworking, thrill seeking, etc. The idea is the activity produces a natural body hormonal response (like adrenalin or oxytocin or endomorphs) and we habituate to the feeling we get while engaged in the activity. It rises to the level of addiction when such actions have serious personal and social consequences, and when we are unable to "kick" the activity without some kind of intervention. Not necessarily part of the discussion but if we are examining the link between addictive personalities and CHs, there is a whole lot more territory to cover. I believe I did see research on the smoking/CH connection and the role of the hypothalmus and endocrine system in both. But, let's remember, the CH is a primary disease, and it would not surprise us to find all sorts of secondary symptoms and attachments. Blessings. lance |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by deltadarlin on Jan 31st, 2011 at 8:52am
Then you have to throw in the nature vs nuture/enviornmental
aspect of addiction. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by SimplyBecky on Feb 1st, 2011 at 12:06am
I find this thread interesting. My CH's started when I was 21. I was a smoker then. When I was a teenager, I messed around with all kinds of drugs, sadly. I think the ONE thing I've never been drawn to is alcohol. I've probably been drunk two or three times in my life and hated every second of it. I drink a few times a year and never have more than 2 or 3 drinks. It just isn't for me. I am so easily addicted to things, and it's why I'm hesitant to take any kind of pills without knowing a lot about them. I'd be popping percocet for the rest of my life if I could. They say when you quit smoking, the cravings go away after a while. It's been 7 years since I had a cigarette, and I miss them every frickin' day. This is why clusterbusters probably would not be the greatest idea for me. Plus, I have depression. It wouldn't be a good combination.
So you can chalk me up as another person with an addictive personality who has CH's. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by bejeeber on Feb 1st, 2011 at 1:32am SimplyBecky wrote on Feb 1st, 2011 at 12:06am:
LOL in a dark humor kind of way about missing them every frikkin day still after 7 years. :D The clusterbuster stuff like RC seeds and mushrooms aren't known to be addicting.....well last I checked anyway....are they? In any event kudos for avoiding the bad addictions and just cultivating the good ones - like nutty pet collections. 8-) I do think you're smart for really considering the depression factor when it comes to the potentially strong stuff like mushrooms, where a bad trip is a possibility. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by SimplyBecky on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 2:22am
The clusterbuster stuff like RC seeds and mushrooms aren't known to be addicting.....well last I checked anyway....are they?quote]
Well, since I never tried it, I don't know if it's addicting. But trust me -- I can make just about anything addicting. I'm terrible! Anything that makes me feel the slightest bit better in any way is addicting to me. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Mike NZ on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 2:26am SimplyBecky wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 2:22am:
You'll love oxygen then! Mind you, I've been addicted to getting a very regular supply of it for all my life and I've no intentions of giving it up. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by SimplyBecky on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 2:39am
Well, oxygen never hurt anyone!! :) Um, right?
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Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Mike NZ on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:08am SimplyBecky wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 2:39am:
It doesn't have a perfect record, e.g. Apollo 1 fire, people smoking whilst on O2, etc, but it's far superior to that of those who stop using it, which is 100% fatal. |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Samiam on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 4:56pm
OK Ok OK, Well then you can say I have an addictive personality...LOL :D I do buy things and it's always in multiples...(you know in case they stop making it) :P I also tend to over eat if in a stressful situation. :-[ I also don't care what you all say shopping is not an addiction :P and I'm not showing this thread to my husband he'll want to know why I don't have a sex addiction :D.....ROFLMAO
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Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Brew on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:30pm Quote:
I've heard it's called "retail therapy." |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by SimplyBecky on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:33pm
Yeah, it works great when you actually have the money to do it.
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Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Samiam on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:33pm Brew wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:30pm:
So then we can check that off the list of addictions then right? ;D |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Samiam on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:35pm SimplyBecky wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 5:33pm:
Money who has money I just use that little plastic thing....Dam that might be a problem....LOL ;) |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by wimsey1 on Feb 4th, 2011 at 7:22am
I know the tenor of this thread is rather humerous (arrh...arrh...joke...Mork from Ork) but addiction is reserved for those substance abuses and processes that result in serious social consequences....arrest, loss of job, severe family dysfunction...massive debt, etc. We ALL overdo something. This is often more a product of personal insecurity, fear, or in buying two of something, even good family economics. 20 pair of shoes? Or Filet mignon vs. cab steak? Maybe more a personal greed kinda thing. Worth examining during Lent but probably not addiction. So...I'm not saying you can max out your credit cards...just that a little self restraint is often called for.
Can something good for us be addictive? Like hormonal secretions. That's what's debated. If the activity or process results in a full nonstop downward spiral of personal and social consequences...then I say, yes. Just some thoughts. Blessings. lance |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by Samiam on Feb 5th, 2011 at 12:37pm
Hi Lance,
Yes the tune of this thread turned humorist. With some joking but in reality I fully understand addiction. I come from a father who was an alcoholic. Who lost his family his job (after many many years of showing up to work drunk which wasn't good since he was an Air Traffic Controller). His house and his kids. I haven't seen him in many many years. Funny he had all the traits of clusters yet he did not develop them. Heavy drinker, heavy smoker, rugged skin and light eyes, male. I often wonder if this condition is genetic. My BIL who was the best person that you could have known walk away from a wife and 4 kids to live on the streets and not really have a job other then just to make enough to buy drugs and alcohol. True addiction. Our family has been devastated by addiction so I understand all to well what a true addict is willing to forgo in order to maintain their addiction. I have friends that fight addiction everyday and twin cousins that both experiment with drugs only to find out one could stop and the other could not this is after 20 yrs. I also believe that many tend to medicate themselves for a mental problem that goes undiagnosed. Bi polar tends to be one of the leading cause of addiction or self medication. As for myself, I don't over indulge in CC's, (paid at the end of each month in full) I don't over indulge with alcohol (I don't like the way my head feels altered) my family is not put in danger or financial ruin by my decisions. I don't take pain killers for this condition since I understand all to well that they don't help and only lead to problems. I have used pain killers prior in my life but once the problem that lead to me using them subsided the drugs were stopped. Many in my day were giving hard core drugs to battle the clusters which really never stopped the pain other then put you in a state of not caring. Been there, done that. It wasn't until I came here several years ago did I even know about O2 and I have been with Neuro's for years. I was still given Stadol and delalid (sp?) up until 1995. My treatment did not start to consist of DHE 45 until 95 and then when the shots kinda went by the waist side I was put on Imitrex. I was never lucky enough to find a preventive after trying almost all of them. I do believe that this cycle was very different. I had started on 5HTTP and within a month of taking this the clusters started. Which was Dec 26th. It's Feb 5th and I have not had any serious hits since 1/20. Maybe one or two but that's it and they were only kip 2's. So for me either my cycle changed (cycle was 6-8 weeks) or the 5 Http which alters serotonin was what triggered this hit. It would also make sense since it would take about that long for the body to go back to baseline. So you have to wonder if people that develop Clusters are predisposed to a gene that also is in common with addicts. My conclusion would be yes. That doesn't mean that all that have clusters will also become addicts just means you would have to look further into this connection. Blessings, Sami |
Title: Re: Strong link between cluster headache and gene ADH4 Post by wimsey1 on Feb 8th, 2011 at 7:01am
Good letter and response, Samiam. It is tragic when lives are led into disaster through a need to self-medicate emotions and bad situations. It is truly a death spiral. As to the 5HTP...I agree with you. I tried it maybe 4 years ago and it increased the cycle I was in at the time. Blessings. lance
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