My best friend had knee surgery and was given coumadin to combat blood clots,  He called me with the worst headache ever and I put him on my tank.  His headache went away and I thought I was a hero.  Turns out he had a bleeder in his brain and all I did was mask his symptoms.  The next day he had a massive stroke that pretty much left him in the state of Fifty First Dates.  The Pic is of Tom just before they radiated his brain
   Be damned careful of over zealousness giving advice.

               Potter

---

This is something I find myself constantly struggling with. Bob Johnson good naturedly pokes me now and then for offering a lot of things to try, which risks complicating the current diagnosis and treatment regimen people may be on.

I always advice people they should get to a Headache specialist neurologist. That's their best option. For so many, that's just not available. They come here because they are hurting, and no one is helping them. Someone with sudden, severe onset headache pain, should see a doctor, like yesterday. But someone with a 10 year history of headaches, with no help from the medical field, I say give them the shotgun approach of everything we use that works. Maybe they'll find something that stops the pain.

But that's just my 2 cents worth!

Joe

I'm so sorry this happened to your friend, Potter. 

Please don't feel guilty, Potter.  I truly believe that I and many others in that situation would have done the same exact thing.

I know I would have.

Brew wrote on Oct 17^th, 2013 at 2:40pm:

I know I would have.

Ditto.....and have.

I'm sorry Potter....Please, don't feel this was your fault.  The stroke would most likely have happened no matter what....02, pain meds, etc.  It's sad but that's the result of brain bleeds.   :'(

Potter,
Your intention was sincere and you are an awesome best friend to Tom. Please do not feel guilty over this! 

As others have mentioned, I also would have done the exact same as you.  You are a good man Potter and glad to have met you last year and look forward to meeting you again.

-Gregg in Las Vegas

You did what many here might have done. We need to remember that we are not medical doctors.

However in posting here about what happened and using it to educate us is a big step as it might  help one of us from repeating this mistake.

I hope your friend recovers from his stroke.

Potter,

I didn't reply to this on first reading, feeling a need to think on my reply rather than my knee-jerk reaction that I would have done the same thing.

After sleeping on it, and a good deal of thought I have to say I would have done the same thing.  Our first response is to alleviate pain.  Had he treated himself with OTC pain meds he would have had the same result, except probably worse.  Frankly, I doubt your providing O2 actually made anything worse.  The only possible way the bleeder would have been found sooner would have been if he had gone directly to the hospital and the ER doc had enough sense to put him in an MRI/MRA immediately, and we all know what the chances of that are.  Their first response would have been the same as yours, provide pain relief, except they would most likely have used opiates or narcs, with the same results.

Please, set your mind at ease.  I know if I was in his shoes I would have no one i would want to turn to more quickly than you, this incident makes no difference in that opinion. 

When you talk to Tom next, please tell him I'm praying for him.  For you, too, my friend.  Thanks for being there for all of us.

Jerry

Potter... I speak from experience.. Strokes are as unpredictable as CH. My husband was pronounced in great shape one day and had a massive stroke the next. No reason - he just did.

Don't beat yourself up .. just be there for Tom and know that there are a lot of prayers going out for the both of you.

You did what any one of would have done and what the ER would have done.  :-*

Potter, I know this won't help. But, for what it's worth, your intentions were well-meaning. And, you can't blame yourself for something as unpredictable as a stroke.

I'm truly sorry about your friend.

Anthony

The way I see it is you provided him a measure of pain free comfort before what was probably inevitable occurred.

Hi Potter,
That's what true friends do [smiley=worried.gif] try to help
when duty calls.

Hoppy.

You did nothing wrong.

Bump,  as some in their over zealousness seem to have forgotten.

              Potter

I read what you went through with Tom. I can't say that I fully understand where your head is, because: No, I haven't been there. Shit happens.

Yeah, there is a happy medium in the quest to provide information to people who are teetering on the edge. Without the level of sharing that we are talking about, many of us wouldn't be walking the planet today. 

I almost took down my O2 pages because of your post about Tom - and I still might. After all, I don't need O2 anymore... ....so why bother. Someone might light up a smoke and take out the whole neighborhood.

But I learned about dealing with CH's here - a whole lot of years ago. For now, I will stand behind the idea that we offer suggestions for people to explore on their own. We aren't prescribing medications, shoving vitamins and "cures" down peoples throat. We are offering insight for folks to take into consideration with their medical professionals. Sometimes that means showing them the incompetence of their doctor.

Not everyone with head pain has CH's. You've pointed that out more than once! But because you know "our pain" you care. I know that.

Where is the break point of sharing our common experience and gained knowledge?  I honestly don't know, because as a whole, the medical community is just now trying to catch up with us.

I will say loudly and clearly:
When I landed here in 1999, I was lost and sinking fast
Multiple doctors took me down several wrong roads ineffective drugs
The overzealous folks from the old, old site put me back on my feet with a will to fight

They didn't just tell me to take two aspirin and call my doctor - that would have thinned my blood........

Yeah - your point is more than correct - I'm NOT hinting otherwise. What I am posing is the question:

Where is the dividing line?

Best to you my friend.
Marc

Brilliant, heartfelt post, Marc.  Well done!

Thanks Marc, you put my thoughts into words, it's a line I always fight with, trying to find that happy medium.

Joe

Potter, I haven't responded to this thread because I honestly don't know what to say. I know you're feeling guilty, but I don't walk in your shoes.

I will say though, that I'm sure we've all had those "woulda, coulda, shoulda" moments throughout our lives.  I had them after my mom died. But it's not my fault she died. I did not make the decision to forgo treatment. I did not choose a different route. It was all hers.


I'm so very sorry about your friend. :(  [smiley=hug.gif]



xo-mel