Hey guys since returning from Dallas the Demon has been after me.  I am getting hit usually about twice in the afternoon but I am able to abort rather quickly with O2 (usually 7-10 minutes, but I must confess I don't wait to kip up very high before I get on the O2, okay I am chicken).  However, what has been occurring is I am getting hit a night every hour.  I wake up with usually not more that 3-5 pain level and immediately get on O2 and abort in say 10 minutes and fall back asleep only to be awakened in about an hour and repeat.  This goes on all night.  First let me say during the night I am still using my O2 Concentrator so I know is am getting less O2 than with the tank but I do aborb.  My question after all this rambling is could the use of O2 be causing me rebound with CH or am I just in a cycle having this many hits?  I am trying hard not to use Imitrex to abort.  I would appreciate any thoughts you guys may have.   :(

Hi Ernie.  Sorry the beast is kicking your butt right now.  I feel for ya brother.

To my knowledge, O2 doesn't cause rebounds.  However reattacks are not unusual.  You see once you've achieved abort, the conditions that set things in motion still persist.  So it is possible for the beast to wake you back up again.

How long are you staying on the O2?  I usually abort in 10 minutes or less but stay on the tank for a full 15.  I also drink coffee or an energy drink to back the O2 up.  Don't go right back to bed.  Wait another 10-15 mintes to see if the attack begins to come back.  If it does, hit him with another 15 minutes of O2.  This approach will generally keep the beast at bay for me.

Of course for those rare occasions where this doesn't work I fall back on my Imitrex or an Amerge to stay asleep the rest of the night.

Are you on any preventives?  Forgive me if you've already covered this somewhere else.

Hope this helps some.  Wishing you PFDAN soon.

-Dennis-

Hi Ernie
I had the same happening back in June 07 when in a high cycle; I know the routine only to well, huff up sleep for an hour, huff up sleep for an hour.

I had some Imigran tablets that as everyone knows aren’t worth a piece of cocky s@#t when trying to kill a hit but what I did find with them was if I took one while I was huffing on the o2 it would give me a 6-8 hour break before I would get another hit, it worked as though it was a preventive.

The strange thing about it was if I took one before or after a hit it wouldn’t work, it would only work if I took the tab while huffing away, tis a weird monster we deal with. :o

Cheers
Barry

Thanks guys, Dennis as to meds I am on more than Carter has little pills (for we older chaps used to be liver pills until they discovered the pills did nothing for the liver)  verapamil 480mg daily, lithium 600mg daily and topomax 400mg daily.  I do stay on the O2 for about 5 min after aborting.  I guess the demon is showing his rear end.  I have been a CH for 12 yrs and this is the first time this particular event has occurred.  Normally my first line of attack has been to hit the imitrex and then jump on the O2, but I have been relying soley on O2 so I thought maybe because I was being hit so many times the O2 might be causing a rebound.  As I said earlier (knock on wood) fortunately thus far I have not been awakened with an 8 or 9 which I have in the past.  If this were occurring every hour I am not quite sure what I would do, so long as they are in the 3-5 range as Donna Summer sang I will Survive.  One note and I cannot remember who posted, but last night at 3:50 I got up and did not get on O2 (granted it was at the most a 4.5) and went the bathroom and did the pumping of my arms above my head.  I did not have a clock in the bathroom so I have no idea how long I did this, but I am not not long (as we all do I smoke like crazy am 60 years old so what do you expect) but after I gave out pumping the sucker was gone.  I did not drink a Red Bull or anything.  I did blow my nose and went back to bed and did not have another attack and did not wake up until 6:45 which is 45 minutes later than normal (I don't set a clock I just wake up every day between 5:30 and 6:00 CST).  I did have some shadows so I drank a Red Bull and drank strong coffee.  If you are reading this I apologize for the length, but I thought it may be of interest.  Julie says I am extremely verbose in speech and obviously this trait carries over in print as well.  Thanks again.  Wishbone

So everyone is not confused I sent the last post from Julie's computer that is why it showed up as Mrs Wishbone and not me.  I love her far too much for her to be a Clusterhead.

First hello Ernie and I will pray for you Brother.
sounds like your having a tough go of it. I know I feel like I have been forsaken sometime and my prayers go unanswered but when the hits stop and the pain goes away i just love the lord more.
No I don't think the O2 is causing you rebounds.

Karl

Ernie Moss aka Wishbone wrote on Jul 24^th, 2008 at 6:22pm:

but I must confess I don't wait to kip up very high before I get on the O2, okay I am chicken).

Chicken?.......If you ever post that again I will kick your ass and I dont care how old you are!

The first rule of 02 is to get on it as soon as you feel it coming.....that sir is not chicken, its smart!

If you want to talk about rebounds, talk Trex......it rebounds the hell out of a lot of us.

Try Zomig nasal spray.....no rebounds and last twice as long for a lot of us.  ;)

Just what Dennis said.  Not rebounds but a reattack.  Pretty much the attack isn't really over, you just temporarily aborted the pain.  So its hard to say sometimes how many attacks you are getting while on o2.  Thats my experience anyway

I increased my duration from 15 min to 20 because of the same effect you were having. I got to where I was using triptans same as Barry mentioned. Hit the 02,gulp down 50mg of triptans.The beast would catch up with the trex. After a few day's trex would fail. so I used 02 for a day and switched to Frova, then Relpax...and sometimes the beast would still kick me around. Tuning in technique and duration of the 02 therapy made some differance at least for me. Increasing volume can make some differance as well.
Never got rebounds...just reattacks. Chronics have been very helpful with my education on 02. Their very good at it. Guess you would have to be.
all the best and I hate it for ya.
thebb ;)

Thanks guys for the all the replies.  I did not think the O2 was causing the problem, just wanted to confirm that the Demon was just angry right now.  Not hitting trix much so that is not the problem either.  I am getting some zomig ns as I did good things about it at Convention, but what I read on internet it said it took 10mg to aborb but it comes in 5mg spray, I guess you just try the 5mg and see what happens, huh.  Jonny, although Martial Arts is my hobby (4th degree Black Belt Karate) and still compete when not in cycle I promise I won't call myself a chicken again.  Thanks Again.  BTW the Black Belt stuff is a joke not a vicious bone in my body.  Wishbone

Go ahead Ernie -- whup up on Jonny :) Put the little twirp back in line..

Ok, are you taking any melatonin before bedtime. If not try it (12-15mg) before bedtime and see if that will get you thru the REM sleep and help with the night hits. Works pretty good for me.

Have you got a 25 liter regulator -- they're wonderful.

And you heard Goadsby -- we're a TUFF bunch - not a chicken little amongst us.

Hope you're PF soon.

Hugs BD

No BD I am not on melatonin.  What is it?  Yes I do have a 25LPM regulator for my E Tank, but as I said I have been using my concentrator at night simply because it is so much easier.  I know I know.  But like I said the hits have not been in the real high kip (3-5) and mistakenly I thought they were aborting in about 10 minutes and I was staying on another 5 minutes.  What I have not been doing was drinking coffee or a RB.  I was just going back to sleep.  

Melatonin is an OTC thingy -- it helps you get thru the REM sleep (where most CH's happen). It's helped me (and a lot of others here)get thru most night hits.

You can get it at any drug store, Wal-mart or grocery store - try the Vitamin isle. I take 15mg at night. It's the ingredient in Rozerian (or whatever that sleeping pill is that they advertise on TV with Abe Lincoln and all the friends telling the guy he needs to sleep so he can dream of them). It's really been great for me - I can actually get some rest at night.

Hugs BD

Thanks BD I'll try that.  I had even thought about turning my Concentrator down to 2LPM and sleeping with on all night.  When I sleep my heart rate drops down to probably as low as 40 bpm so I was thinking I may be getting too little O2.  My normal resting heart rate is about 60-64 during the day time.

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Neurotransmitter



Quote:

In humans, melatonin is produced by the pineal gland, a gland about the size of a pea, located in the center of the brain. The melatonin signal forms part of the system that regulates the circadian cycle by chemically causing drowsiness and lowering the body temperature, but it is the central nervous system (more specifically, the suprachiasmatic nucleus) that controls the daily cycle in most components of the paracrine and endocrine systems[23][24] rather than the melatonin signal (as was once postulated).

:)

Ernie - Don't start your melatonin usage at 15mg. The recommendations on the label usually say "take one 3mg tablet just before bed." This is for people who don't have CH, but 15mg is five times the recommended dosage, so you may want to start lower than that until you become accustomed to what it does to you.

If you were to wake up 90 minutes after taking 15mg to abort a hit, it's conceivable that you might fall over when you get out of bed. I take 6mg before bed, and if I have to get up to pee, I notice how messed up my equilibrium is.

In short, start low and work higher if needed.

Thanks Brew with the meds I already take I drinks tons of H2O during the night so I always have to go to the bathroom whether I have a hit or not so for sure I would have busted it, our bedroom is carpeted and we have a sofa at the end of the bed so a fall in the bedroom may not have been so bad, but our bathroom is huge with slate floor so if I had made it that far heavens knows what I would have done to myself.

To My darling husband (Wishbone/Ernie Moss):  

You need to proof read your posts.  Sometimes they don't make sense or it sounds like you don't know proper English!  

Hugs and Kisses, Your Wife (Mrs. Wishbone/Julie Moss)

I understood him.

Thanks Brew, but I don't make sense most of the time and just because I have 19 years of formal education I never claimed to know English. :D ;D

Just kidding you honey.  

Mrs. Wishbone wrote on Jul 25^th, 2008 at 6:52pm:

Just kidding you honey.

It's okay, dear. I forgive you.

Thanks Brew, my precious, darling, sweetie pie, honey bunch!!

BarbaraD wrote on Jul 25^th, 2008 at 10:18am:

Ok, are you taking any melatonin before bedtime. If not try it (12-15mg) before bedtime and see if that will get you thru the REM sleep and help with the night hits. Works pretty good for me.

Yeah, Barb, but too bad the sleep you DO get is not BEAUTY sleep ...

Mean Ole Crotchety Chuck

(Hep me!!! Hep me!  A mean ornery ole broad is out to get me!!!)

Mrs. Wishbone wrote on Jul 24^th, 2008 at 8:54pm:

Dennis as to meds I am on more than Carter has little pills (for we older chaps used to be liver pills until they discovered the pills did nothing for the liver)  verapamil 480mg daily, lithium 600mg daily and topomax 400mg daily.

Ummmmm ... Got a question here ...  Maybe you know more than I do, after all, you are much MUCH older than I am.  I am only 58 ... (even so, I DO remember when they were called Carter's Liver Pills ...)

BUT, (the infamous BUT) Why are you taking all those preventative meds, if they are not doing anything?

I used to take those and more, until I realized, I was STILL getting hit, and they did not seem to do anything for me.  I finally just stopped taking anything (WITH my Doctor's knowledge and assistance) as a preventative.  Why take all that crap, if it doesn't do what it is designed to do?

Once I cleaned out my system of all that shit, I feel SO much better!  The clusters are the same (for me) with or without meds.  I prefer to be drug free, if they aren't doing their job.

But, maybe that is because I am just a young whipper-snapper, and not an old geezer ....   (GAWD, I love it when I can say that!!!  It is so rare to find those older than me!  My kids don't believe ANYONE is older than me ... DAMN kids!)

Chuck

Chuckles my darhling... sometimes it's not the chronical AGE, but the MILAGE..... :)  Wishbone and I BOTH together don't have YOUR milage!!!!

As to the "beauty sleep" remark -- you know I'll get you for that one!!!

Hugs BD

My dear Child ClusterChuck had you not been so concerned about trying to beat BD to the punch on pinching butts at Convention you may have remembered we discussed this very subject.  Up until now I have been espisodic and not chronic like you, so when I go out of cycle the preventatives I think do work because when I paper off verapamil or litium I immediately start having hits, but up my dose again they go away.  Now certainly I cannont prove that the meds are what is stopping the hits but that is the only thing I can associate to it.  My cycles are not longer like they were when I first became a CH.  Then they were 3mos on 3mos off.  Now they are random.  Hence if taking the meds and I can get 6mos off then I think it is worth is.  Certainly I could be 110% wrong but that has been my thinking. Some told me I really was chronic and maybe so I don't.  But thanks for your thought young one.  ::)

Thanks BD for coming to my defense, you know how sensitive Chuck is and I did not want to hurt his feelings so I was just going to let it pass but you set him straight for me.  I really am glad he told me his age because if ever I was in Greenville, NC I was going to search first the assisted living then nursing homes to try and visit him.  ;D

BarbaraD wrote on Jul 26^th, 2008 at 11:39am:

the MILAGE..... :)

But what GREAT mileage it has been!  WOOHOO!!!



Ernie Moss aka Wishbone wrote on Jul 26^th, 2008 at 11:45am:

Hence if taking the meds and I can get 6mos off then I think it is worth it.

Then the meds ARE doing something for you, Gramps!  FANTASTIC!!!  Then keep taking them, if in your advanced age, you can remember to do so ...




Ernie Moss aka Wishbone wrote on Jul 26^th, 2008 at 11:54am:

I was going to search first the assisted living then nursing homes to try and visit him.

Try the local nut house.  Go to the rubber walled room.  I should be there ...

Chuck

Chuck,

I think the commercial used to say "Carter's Little Liver Pills" and as far as aging goes, I added more than my share of years over the last week.

Ernie, hang on, help is on the way.  Check your email.

Take care,

V/R, Batch