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MPMIII CH.com Veteran Offline Posts: 112 Alabama Gender:	Welders 02 Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:06am Does anyone know where can I find a regulator for a welders 02 tank? Is there a site online that sells them? I would prefer a higher than 15 lpm. I have been using medical 02 and want to go to a bigger tank, but my medical supply is not being cooperative. Thanks in advance. Malcom
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ClusterChuck CH.com Alumnus Offline The BEAST rises again, and again, and again, and . Posts: 5394 Greenville, North Carolina Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #1 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:11am I may be wrong, but I am fairly certain that any regulator with a CGA540 connector will fit just ducky! Chuck
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midwestbeth Ex Member	Re: Welders 02 Reply #2 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:44am I purchased a CGA-540 regulator at the supply house for less than $20.00. The only thing I had to add to it was the brass connector for the 02 hose. Beth
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Marc Ex Member Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #3 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:48am Yes, you are correct - any CGA540 regulator will fit and welding O2 tank. Here is a picture of my CGA540 regulator sitting on a T size welding tank Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!! You need to or MPMIII, are you sure that you need more than 15LPM? Marc
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midwestbeth Ex Member	Re: Welders 02 Reply #4 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:53am Beautiful pic Marc!
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Marc Ex Member Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #5 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 10:57am Quote: Beautiful pic Marc! Smart alec...... As I've said before, my camera can take really bad pictures too!
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MPMIII CH.com Veteran Offline Posts: 112 Alabama Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #6 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 11:37am I am using an E tank right now and the bag does not stay inflated all the time. I think a higher lpm would remedy the situation. I looked online and found several regulators priced from 70-150 dollars. Most of the ones I found say "click style", do these work as well? Thanks again. Malcom
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midwestbeth Ex Member	Re: Welders 02 Reply #7 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 11:54am The welding regulator I use goes up as high as I need it to. I have no idea how high the lpm (it is measured in psig), but when it got turned up high by accident, it blew the hose off the connector. If it hadn't, I'm sure it would have popped the bag.
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Marc

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #8 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 12:15pm

MPMIII wrote on Nov 14^th, 2008 at 11:37am:

I am using an E tank right now and the bag does not stay inflated all the time. I think a higher lpm would remedy the situation. I looked online and found several regulators priced from 70-150 dollars. Most of the ones I found say "click style", do these work as well? Thanks again.

Malcom

Beth is right - you have any problem getting enough flow with a welding regulator! Wink

It can be tough to control though.......

Here is one that Chuck found online recently. The quality is unknown.

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My newer regulator is the click style and yes, it's fine. The only difference is that you can only pcik the flow rates in increments or "steps" in lieu of fine adjustments.

Marc

Marc

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MPMIII CH.com Veteran Offline Posts: 112 Alabama Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #9 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 12:40pm Marc, Thanks for the help. I just ordered the one you gave a link to. I will let you know about the quality when I get it. It has got to better than my existing set up. Malcom
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Marc Ex Member Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #10 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 4:27pm I've had three people ask for more info, so I just put this up now: Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!! You need to or Be sure to see all 5 pages
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itotka

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #11 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 4:42pm

Quote:

The welding regulator I use goes up as high as I need it to. I have no idea how high the lpm (it is measured in psig), but when it got turned up high by accident, it blew the hose off the connector. Shocked

If it hadn't, I'm sure it would have popped the bag.

Medical regulator's outgoing pressure is about 50 psi, welding reg. works on 200 (or more) psi.

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Balanchine CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 238 x0\|Los Angeles\|USA\|\|0\|0\|CA,Cal Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #12 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 7:00pm Here's mine. Think I paid about 90 bucks for it, bought it from the welding company and the guy added the connectors to make it work, which it does. I can pump that baby up as high as I want! David
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Potter CH.com Alumnus Offline Team MOOSE DROOL Stinky Stuff on a Hook Prostaff Posts: 3600 Blgs.Mt. Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #13 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 7:04pm I love these success stories. Good on ya. Potter
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Linda_Howell CH.com Moderator CH.com Alumnus Offline Do not feed the Moderators Posts: 11927 Santa Maria, Ca. Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #14 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 7:51pm Quote: are you sure that you need more than 15LPM? Marc, I learned after 21 years that yes, indeed more than 15 LPM works so much better and faster. My welders tank has a regulator so high it could blow my lungs out if I cranked it up.
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Marc

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #15 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:44pm

You will get no argument from me on what you need. We all have different lung capacities.

My point is that sooo many people get hung up on numbers instead of THE ONLY important factor: Maintaining 100% oxygen in every breath. No room air included.

If people just watch the bag on the mask, they will know what they need. If it stays puffed up full and overflows, the user is just wasting oxygen and could use a lower setting to conserve. If it gets close to empty (but not empty) at the end of an inhale – they are getting 100%. If it goes empty – the flow is too low. All of this OF COURSE asumes a good mask.

Putting it another way: If I only breath at a rate of 15lpm, then 16lpm isn't better because it isn’t getting into my lungs. I tend ask people if they know why they need a 25lpm regulator for this reason. Every day of needless suffering is a bad thing. Yes! Forget the numbers and go for a full-on welders regulators - it will never give you too little.

Grin

One more time for the sake of pure clarity: Many people need 25lpm regulators to keep up with their breathing pace. Some need 60lpm or more. Many sufferers do very, very well with 15lpm regulators and a large reservoir bag.

Do I sound like Den yet? Grin

Marc

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« Last Edit: Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:48pm by Marc »

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Linda_Howell CH.com Moderator CH.com Alumnus Offline Do not feed the Moderators Posts: 11927 Santa Maria, Ca. Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #16 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 9:10pm Only if you had said..."take what you need and leave the rest" or that you were "watching the river flow" Other than you just sound like Marc to me.
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Rolomatic Ex Member	Re: Welders 02 Reply #17 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 9:11pm I would add to this by saying that my 8 yr old son can take 15 LPM. If you can only take 15 than you are not breathing fast enough. The faster you reach O2 saturation, the faster the pain goes away.
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Balanchine CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 238 x0\|Los Angeles\|USA\|\|0\|0\|CA,Cal Gender:	Re: Welders 02 Reply #18 - Nov 17^th, 2008 at 7:30pm I say, if the room doesn't start to spin you're not sucking hard enough.
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Batch

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #19 - Nov 18^th, 2008 at 12:48pm

Hmmm... One of my favorite topics... Oxygen therapy is most effective if the flow rate is high enough to support hyperventilation. For a few folks, that starts at a flow rate of 25 liters/minute... The rest of us need much higher flow rates. In short, if you're not getting dizzy with tingling lips, nose, and extremities (paresthesia), your flow rate is too low and your aborts are taking much longer than needed.

You need to breathe in and out as completely and rapidly as the flow rate supports. Any trapped air will allow CO2 to build and that will negate the benefits of hyperoxia (breathing 100% oxygen). Sit up straight as your music teacher used to say or sit back in a recliner with your legs out as straight as possible to give your diaphragm full control. Sitting bent over your knees is a No-No.

Hyperventilating on 100% oxygen is also very safe as long as you're seated. I've over 3,000 hours flying Navy jets and all of it was spent breathing 100% oxygen... frequently at flow rates well above 25 liters/minute... I always made it back to the carrier for a trap (arrested landing), and I'm still here today more than 25 years later sucking down 100% oxygen fast enough to hyperventilate.

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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MrsT

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #20 - Nov 19^th, 2008 at 7:21am

Marc wrote on Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:44pm:

Many people need 25lpm regulators to keep up with their breathing pace. Some need 60lpm or more. Many sufferers do very, very well with 15lpm regulators and a large reservoir bag.

Actually I did "okay" with 8 LPM until this episode. 8 LPM AND a regular facial mask (no bag). It still works but not fast enough to completely abort an attack, meaning 8 LPM suppresses the pain while Imitrex was kicking in.

This time I've experimented my O2 intake with a stopwatch. If I let CH hurt me, as in not getting to the O2 at the earliest sign, blasting O2 and breathe as fast and deep as I can (almost) for a brief period of time can quickly reduce the pain. But it's hard work!

To me, the key is really to get to the O2 ASAP when the shadow is reaching the "threshold" where the pain can develop in no time. I've finally learned in this cycle that it's best to NOT wait until I hurt badly. Then I don't need to work that hard to suck on O2, especially half awake. I used to wait until I absolutely had to get up, as if CH somehow goes away so that I could go back to sleep. There's no stopping of the CH if it's bad enough to wake me up! Then I've trained myself to wake up when the shadow is just "getting there", kinda like mothers or caretakers of the sick can wake right up to the smallest but "right" noise. Provided Verapamil is doing its job, O2 alone can abort CH, and in my case 15 LMP (I'm guessing from my breath count) is enough to abort CH in its early stage. But it's definitely good to have the option of going to a much higher flow in case we can't get to the O2 until the CH is killing us.

A high flow works quickly, no question. But I've concluded that the total volume of O2 I use is about the same per attack. "Breathe as fast & deep as I can" by blasting the flow can abort the immediate pain but not the whole attack; I'd need to continue at a lower flow anyway to completely kill the attack to avoid a re-attack. So for me, either wait till it hurts me badly and work hard to suck O2 in panic or get to O2 ASAP and not have to breathe so hard but read a book or play a game with O2.

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Marc

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Re: Welders 02
Reply #21 - Nov 19^th, 2008 at 11:26am

I'm one of the lucky people for whom oxygen works like magic, since I started working with RC seeds.

I strongly agree about hitting the tank as soon as I have a hint that a CH is coming. While I'm still getting hit, it's NOTHING like the old days. I haven’t seen a K10 in two years and I really only suffer when I can't get O2 fast enough.

I know that I can kill it with only 30 breaths (worst case about 60)- so I focus on counting. So I've learned not to panic. I can remain calm knowing it will not get bad and it will be gone inside of 2-3 minutes.

I suspect that O2 saturation is effected by how good our lungs are at transferring the O2 to the blood. Using a welding regulator is probably the best bet for some people. 25LPM isn't enough for a person who can inhale/exhale 3-5 liters or more, per breath – if they need to go into hyper ventilation mode.

Marc

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