Why in hell should anyone consider an anesthetic used for any kind of surgery also to be useful against CH, vasoconstrictor or not  

                 

Lidocaine spray is prescribed sometimes to abort CH attacks.  Last visit to the neuro's office Gary had an attack, and Doc shoved huge Q-tip thingies up his nose with a bunch of lidocaine goop on them.  Didn't do anything except freeze his teeth and part of the upper palate of his mouth.  ....and of course made him really uncomfortable as he had to lie there instead of being able to get up and move around.

This is from the Medical Info button on the left:

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Lidocaine

Kittrelle et al (1985)A showed that the intranasal instillation of 1 ml 4 percent topical lidocaine was effective in terminating attacks in four of five patients.  The patients were instructed to lie supine, with their heads extended backward 45 degrees and rotated 30 to 40 degrees toward the side of the headache.   One ml lidocaine was slowly dropped into the nostril ipsilateral to the pain, and the patient's position was maintained for several minutes.  If nasal congestion mad it impossible to deliver the anesthetic solution to it target, the patient was initially treated with a few drops of intranasal 0.5 percent phenylephrine.  These investigators believed that the lidocaine reached the sphenopalatine fossa and anesthetized the sphenopalatine ganglion.  That is certainly possible but, and addition, local blockade of terminals of the trigeminal and glossopharyngeal nerves intranansally could also decrease afferent activity to the spinal trigeminal nucleus, stopping the pain because of convergence of the sensory elements of cranial nerves V, VII, IX, and X.  The beneficial effect of topical lidocaine surely does not implicate the sphenopalatine ganglion in the mechanism of cluster headache.  I find lidocaine to be an extremely useful therapeutic adjunct.  The 1 ml dose may need to be repeated once or twice.  For may patients, the application of lidocaine via the continuous pumping of a plastic nasal spray bottle is superior.  In my experience, lidocaine is useful for about 60 percent of patients.

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If Lydia and her CH sufferer want to party, I recommend shrooms.   

Laurie

Garys_Girl wrote on Jan 4^th, 2009 at 7:20pm:


Now that there is some bad brained thinkin goin on.  What were you thinking when you made that comment?

           Kinder gentler Potter

You are SO right, and the bbz, I am SO sorry.  I obviously wasn't thinking, and is totally thoughtless.  I'd jump down the throat of anyone posting something like that because so many have worked for so long to remove just that kind of stigmatism to the use of psilocybin (or LSD or LSA) for therapeutic medical reasons, and thank you for calling me on it.

Please accept my apologies. 

Laurie

Kudo's to you Laurie, you're a class act!

And be careful everyone, a supporter came here and asked a question. My neuro told me 30 years ago that cocaine had a positive effect on CH, that's why he initially gave me the lidocaine drops to try as an abortive. It didn't work for me. She may honestly be trying to help someone. Many of us have considered chopping our heads off during a KIP 10.  Asking about cocaine is mild by comparison!

I'm hoping we haven't scared away a supporter by jumping down her throat. Let's try and remember a lot of scared people come here looking for answers, letr's not scare them away. While I agree wholeheartedly that street drugs are no answer to CH, you can tell someone it's a bad idea, without comparing them to a mouth breathing moron!

Joe's humble opinion.

Guiseppi wrote on Jan 5^th, 2009 at 5:15pm:


She was pretty clear: "I have been doing extensive research and it seems that smoking crack can abort."

That's bullsh&t.

Whatever response she received was appropriate. If she's embarrassed - she should be. There's no extensive research to tell anyone that smoking crack is an abortive.

I'm not going to get all analytical and self-questioning over someone that would consider giving crack as an abortive to their sufferer. The answer is f-No.

Scott

One and done because she's crazy? Or because her first question was met with such abuse? Like I said, a medical doctor, a neuro, told me 30 years ago that cocaine had a positive effect on CH. Either he made it up...not likely...or some research existed...way back then....to back it up.

You can tell someone an idea is not good, and back it up with research. Or you can tell them their idea is stupid, ridicule them, chase them away, and make danged sure they never come to us looking for advice again. Which do you suppose DJ set up this site for?

Joe

Potter wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2009 at 12:36pm:
Gosh Potter, you were really kind on this one 

Guiseppi wrote on Jan 5^th, 2009 at 5:15pm:


In the mid to late 90s, when my CHs started, I was a heavy cocaine user.  For many years, I thought my CHs were sinus issues brought on by the cocaine.  I do recall during that time, cocaine would abort an attack.  At the same time my cycles would last about 3 weeks longer than they do now.  I haven't used cocaine in almost 10 years, but if the attack was bad enough and it was put in front of me, I would do it.  

Quote:


Pronunciation:*fl*nt, *fl*nt
Function:verb
Etymology:perhaps of Scandinavian origin; akin to Old Norse flana to rush around more at  PLANET
Date:1566

intransitive senses 
1 : to display or obtrude oneself to public notice
2 : to wave or flutter showily *the flag flaunts in the breeze*
transitive senses 
1 : to display ostentatiously or impudently : PARADE *flaunting his superiority*
2 : to treat contemptuously *flaunted the rules Louis Untermeyer*
synonyms see SHOW
  –flaunt noun 
  –flauntingly \*fl*n-ti*-l*, *fl*n-\  adverb 
  –flaunty \-t*\  adjective 

Funny I don't feel like I am flaunting anything by treating my CH with mushrooms. More like pushed in a corner.
Social stigma with these things there is.....Yoda voice

No, we are not all reading the same thing. Funny how some will not read an entire post, and grab onto a few words, and then try to proceed to shove them down someone's throat, when all they are asking is a simple question. And a newbie, no less.

Thank you for posting, sorry you were driven off the board. I hope the people who had helpful suggestions, were indeed helpful to you. And to answer your question about smoking lidocaine.... don't do it. There are other forms of it available to use for the treatment of CH that are much safer.

purpleydog wrote on Jan 6^th, 2009 at 10:40pm:


I read it, and she asked about smoking crack. Crack is not a good idea.

gizmo wrote on Jan 7^th, 2009 at 8:23am:


She asked about smoking "crack". Whether she thought it was an option or not, she asked about smoking "crack". WTF? What part of "it seems that smoking crack can abort" doesn't sound as though she is talking about "crack"? This is idiotic.  No one ran her off. She was one and done and gone.

Some ask about crack, some ask about mushrooms, some ask about LSD, some ask about seeds, ...
Except for the level of danger I can't see a difference there, especially from a newbies point!!!.
I suppose we all were in the situation that we would try anything to get rid of CH.

It is ok to tell a newbie that smoking crack or any other possible treatment is not the way to go but do we really need to chase them off?

Oliver