I find it interesting that people demanding their rights, demanding that the Constituion be made revelant again, are now terrorists.

Guiseppi wrote on Mar 19^th, 2009 at 4:40pm:

That's exactly what I'm talking about.

Do you think the name Timothy McVeigh has anything to do with the interest that militia groups receive? 

I'm not saying that all people in the militia movement are violent, but there are real nutters out there. People that subscribe to a paranoid, conspiratorial view of the world are more likely to commit acts of violence.  In fact, there have been people on this board recently spouting militia ideology and calling for armed rebellion against the government of the United States. Should anyone be surprised if that leads to increased monitoring? Would such government action be wrong?

Honestly, surveillance of citizens is nothing new. For the past half century, church groups (many that were explicitly pacifist!) were monitored, infiltrated, and harassed for the crime of opposing policy in the Vietnam war, or criticizing military aid to brutal dictatorships in Central America. These people represented zero potential for violence, but were targets nonetheless.

So just let me say ... "welcome to the club."

Oh hell, they've known where I've been for years and haven't come got me yet. I'm still sending letters weekly to DC telling them what I think about all of them.... Maybe they're trying to figure out which list to put me on...

Or maybe they're just trying to figure out which home to put me in...

Hugs BD

"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before".- Rahm Emanuel

You bet Rahm!

When are we going to stop being Democrats or Republicans and start being Americans?  Those bastards have us just where they want us. Look at us...we're stupid beyond my ability to express it. My God I'm beginning to think it's hopeless.

SCREW THIS! VOTE THE JACKASSES OUT OF OFFICE! GET RID OF THE OLIGARCHS!

Steve G

I know Brew.

I'm just sick about it all. I watched the indignation voiced by Representatives during the AIG hearing on C-SPAN last night and I couldn't believe the blather coming form these self-righteous round mouths.

The Government is complicit up to their eyeballs and all they do is say is, "look here at these bad people", when all the while it's them!

Our Country is going to shit and I can't stand these lying bastards. All they do is lie. Screw them and I pray everyone remembers this crap in 20 months and during the next Presidential race.

BTW... I never thought about getting a gun but I purchased one on Monday.  I don't trust the President or the AG... or the Congress for that matter.

We are living in interesting times.

Steve G

Opus wrote on Mar 19^th, 2009 at 9:48pm:

Uh, yeah he did.

I don't want to get into a pissing contest over words, but you said "Ron Paul did not run for president in 2008." He did. On June 12, 2008, he officially withdrew his bid for the Republican nomination.

notseinfeld wrote on Mar 20^th, 2009 at 1:59am:


The whole world stepped in deep stuff.

notseinfeld wrote on Mar 20^th, 2009 at 1:59am:


Maybe, but I routinely have optimistic days where I can see a different scenario. Depending on which economists and fortune tellers we consult, one cause of the great depression was inaction - Hoover did not want to reward deadbeats, and allowed economic failures to happen that started a chain reaction that got completely out of control.

notseinfeld wrote on Mar 20^th, 2009 at 1:59am:


The many differences between wealth and money are worth considering.

The ability of paper money to represent wealth has not been destroyed, but it has been shocked. According to some estimates, one half of the paper wealth in the world disappeared last year.  Inflated asset prices (homes) are part of this. So are derivatives - at one point, there was an estimated 1.14 Quadrillion dollars of derivatives circulating - banks, insurance companies, hedge funds were highly leveraged and making bets and profits with money they didn't have. These collapses will affect pretty much everyone, although a hermit living in a shack might not feel it as much as you and I.

So what then must we do? We can vow to protect the value of paper money and let the other shit hit the fan. That could result in 25-35% unemployment, massive foreclosures, soup lines, etc.  Protecting the purchasing power of my bank account is nice, but stocks in my retirement account would still be shot, and chances are good that I would lose my job and maybe my house - even though I am currently unaffected by the mess.

Another option:  we can try to get credit/debt flowing again - reign in some types of wildly speculative activity, inject money into lending institutions, and then ride it out. It may be that most of the mortgage bundles that are currently unsellable will ultimately have a value which is close to break even, which would allow a recovery with 'moderate' losses. If the institutions stop creating derivatives that no one understands, stability may return with time.  Of course, the second option has real risks of further eroding the value of paper if the money supply is increased and it isn't done right.  But there is no risk-free, guaranteed solution to our problems.


notseinfeld wrote on Mar 20^th, 2009 at 1:59am:


Never a bad idea. The garden will be bigger this year.