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cavalier

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What’s this about the Holy Grail???
May 6^th, 2009 at 6:26pm

Some believe that a priest stumbled on the hidden fortune of the Knights Templar. Others say it was the incredible wealth of the Visigoths, the German tribe who plundered the treasures of Rome and Jerusalem, among them possibly the fabled Ark of the Covenant.
Well!
According to my knowledge, the chalice has a place, top shelf, down at the “dog and duck” my local and the person who drinks from it “long life john” sits there most nights guzzling the old grog, often heard muttering to himself “ why me”
When coherent he tells tales of Arthur and the secrets from the chest stored in his shed
“It’s a curse”, he’d often shout. It seems long life John hadn’t got any relatives, none anyone could remember. Wonder what his blood line is??
I know anything goes nowadays as far as fashion, but an old man in chain mail, perhaps he’s into S&M
That’s just put me off….Where was I...
Back in my crusader days when I was a dragon hunting! Nope!
Anyway after one night of serious grog swilling long life John said “I wanna show you summat”(that’s olde english) and he took me up to his shed.
He threw back this old sack cloth and…………….
I’ve just received payment from the Vatican so you’ll have to make your own minds up

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Batch

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Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #1 - May 6^th, 2009 at 7:58pm

Hmmm… Being an old F-8 Crusader Driver, I do know about Crusaders, but I’ve no idea where you’re going with your last on the Holy Grail… perhaps a bit too much grog or a bit too cavalier?

As an old Navy winged type that’s sailed, steamed, and flown with both Brits and Aussies in my trusty F-8 Crusader, I also know about grog. Having said that, I favor Bundaberg OP, a rather fine Demerara Over Proof from down under rather than that distilled from cane along the Demerara River in eastern Guyana … Taken neat or with coke there’s no rum finer than Bundy…

The F-8 was way too cool and a beautiful fighter to fly... It was a gunfighter with 4 Colt Mk-12 20mm cannons, 2 Sidewinders, the wing went up and down, it took a cat shot like a dream (0 to 170 mph in less than two seconds), it would do a 1,000 miles an hour, whip ugly on the bad guys, then come back and stop on a dime in less than 180 feet...

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A few enterprising Marine Corps pilots even figured out how to fly the Crusader with the wings folded… and landed it safely…

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Now that ranks right up there with the Holy Grail.

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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Opus CH.com Hall of Famer Offline "We have met the enemy... and he is us" Posts: 2746 Sidney,NY USA Gender:	Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail??? Reply #2 - May 6^th, 2009 at 8:02pm Everyone knows the french have it. Paul
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Lefty CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 759 Gender:	Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail??? Reply #3 - May 6^th, 2009 at 9:06pm Batch wrote on May 6^th, 2009 at 7:58pm: … (0 to 170 mph in less than two seconds), it would do a 1,000 miles an hour, Must have been the ultimate thrill ride, how do you top that...(very envious) Lefty....!
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Batch

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Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #4 - May 7^th, 2009 at 3:19pm

Paul,

You’re so correct… the French did fly the F-8E(N) Crusader from the early ‘70s through 1999. They made their final Crusader “trap” and “Cat Shot” on the aircraft carrier Foch in November of 1999 and decommissioned their last squadron of Crusaders in December of that year. Many of us were there.

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F-8E(N) Taking a Gulp at Happy Hour from a Super Étendard Tanker

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Last F-8 Crusader Trap November 27 1999

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Last F-8 Crusader Cat Shot November 27 1999
We had a gathering of 150 US Navy and Marine Corps F-8 Crusader pilots and their wives at Landivisiau Naval Airbase, near Brest France where we met with 100 French F-8 Crusader pilots and their wives for the decommissioning ceremonies.

The French pilots beat up the airfield with their F-8 Crusaders doing two air shows a day for three days. The last day and last flight of the F-8 Crusader they did a 5-plane cross at 550 kts in full afterburner with the low man 100 feet above the ground. The wives went to their knees and the guys just stood there in tears. It had been over 25 years since any of the US pilots had flown the Crusader and the French were flying it into the history books.

When the last F-8E(N) shut down and the whine of the J-57 died out… The champagne corks started popping. They catered a castle for the Crusader Ball that evening and 475 of us tried to put a dent in the French wine supply to no avail.

The next morning we drove to Mont Saint Michel located 50 miles South of the Normandy beachhead for a self-guided tour.
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That was followed by brunch at La Mère Poulard where we ordered their world famous omelettes and more great French wine.
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What a Hoot!

Lefty... I took a slick F-4J Phantom up to Mach 2... but it just wasn't the same. Read the Hemingway quote at the bottom of my posts and you'll get the idea...

The F-4 did have it's advantages and was always a crowd pleaser at the NAS Point Mugu Spacefair.

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This is the famous photo by Harry Gann of VX-4's Vandy-One pushing Mach 1 less than 50 feet above the runway. If you've never seen a fighter go by supersonic... It's a real experience... There's no sound until the aircraft is past your position and then the sonic boom hits like a 105mm Howitzer going off 5 feet away.

We flew Vandy-One in the Space Fair Shows all three years I was stationed at VX-4. I also fired several AIM-9L Sidewinders off this aircraft on the missile range at NWC China Lake.

The Bicentennial F-4S prototype was a bird of a different color... several... The leading edge slats were fixed in the extended position so we had to Mach limit the aircraft at .95 Mach to keep from tearing them off.

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We called this bird "Chicken-Licken" for a couple reasons... The paint job and the fact it would turn circles around other Phantoms. If flown properly, it would also turn with the F-14 Tom Cat and A-4 Skyhawk and you could beat them in a rolling scissors...

I took it up to the Edwards test range to calibrate the airspeed and mach indicators and drop off an AIM-9L sidewinder.

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When I finished my runs on the timing rage I called Edwards Tower for a high speed low altitude fly-by... They refused... but they did approve a low pass by the Tower so they could do visual check to see if the landing gear were up...

Soooo... I flew down the runway at 550 kts and 200 feet... and they confirmed my landing gear were up... Cheesy

Then they asked me to do it again just to be sure... They didn't have their cameras ready... Wink

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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Shawn

Ex Member

Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #5 - May 7^th, 2009 at 4:18pm

Batch,

On my first 'Air Combat' flight, I got locked into a rolling scissors with my opponent. This was my first time *ever* as a pilot. The plane was a fighter/trainer, a 260hp Siai Marchetti F.260. After that dogfight was finished (finally got advantage on him because he blew it going over the top on the 4 time around) the ex-AF guy in the co-pilot seat said "we normally save that maneuver for the advanced class. Good kill". The best part is I got the whole thing on video from 4 different cameras, including the dialog between me and my opponent.

We were flying out of Livermore, Ca and did the dogfighting over Tracy, Ca. I'm pretty sure they closed that particular box since then, but holy moly that was fun.

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Batch

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Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #6 - May 8^th, 2009 at 6:03am

The most fun you'll ever have with your clothes on...

You sound like a natural Shawn. I had two tours as a flight instructor in advanced ACM tactics and the rolling scissors was the most difficult maneuver for most to master. It wasn't the tactic to use in a Phantom against Soviet fighters where "speed is life" and you only sustained a turn long enough to take away displacement or bug out...

We did find that a well flown rolling scissors was the best indication of the discipline required to fly an aircraft on the ragged edge of the controlled flight envelope while still maintaining spatial awareness.

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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Shawn

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Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #7 - May 8^th, 2009 at 12:05pm

Obviously, you're the pro. It was actually quite natural, but I had the help of my co-pilot sounding off my altitude as we went round and round, and he was also giving me on-the-fly (no pun intended) encouragement and guidance. He never once touched the controls. On the 2nd pass over the top, I could hear him grunting like crazy, my adrenaline helped me stay conscious as we were pulling almost 7 G's... but I had to do some grunting too as everything started to go dark on one of the revolutions... the only thought going through my head was 'please don't let my video be one of those blackout examples..."

I had so much fun doing it, I logged 18 dogfights in 12 months. 11 wins, 7 losses. I'd dispute the losses, not the wins.

Would have paid good money to try it out in a jet, but money ran out before I got to go to South Africa where I was scheduled to fly a real jet over Cape Town. Originally, I was going to do the jet first, but I wanted to try the little ones first, and we had the opportunity here in California so I went for it. Hate to admit it, but I spent almost $15K doing it but no regrets.

The program was amazing... 1 1/2 hours of instruction on the ground, then you take off with a co-pilot. He handles the take off and landing, and nothng else unless an emergency develops. At about 500 feet up, he relinquishes the controls completely. They teach you maneuvers for about an hour, then you dogfight. Unmitigated blast, highly recommend if you have money to burn or if carnival rides just don't do it for you anymore.

-Shawn

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Shawn

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Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail???
Reply #8 - May 8^th, 2009 at 12:08pm

Oh yeah, about the 'edge of the envelope"... that was the most amazing thing. As we were doing this, obviously if you pull too hard, you get serious buffeting, but if you don't, the bad guy is going to get you. So, keeping yourself right on that thin line between punishing the plane and surviving the battle was the most exhilarating thing ever.

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Lefty CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 759 Gender:	Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail??? Reply #9 - May 9^th, 2009 at 3:21pm Cav, I had the answer to the true whereabouts of the Holy Grail but I forget because I have been totally distracted by Biggles and The Red Barron. Sorry my friend, it may come back to me...! Lefty...!
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QnHeartMM CH.com Sponsor Offline I AM a Phoenix! Posts: 1783 San Diego, CA Gender:	Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail??? Reply #10 - May 10^th, 2009 at 10:37am Batch those are some VERY COOL pictures!
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BMoneeTheMoneeMan CH.com Alumnus Offline In remembrance of KingCazman. RIP Posts: 2674 Portland, OR	Re: What’s this about the Holy Grail??? Reply #11 - May 10^th, 2009 at 3:09pm Quote: He threw back this old sack cloth and……………. I’ve just received payment from the Vatican so you’ll have to make your own minds up I'm not sure I'm following you. Are you saying he was a Priest and he made an alter-boy out of you? That's horrible. I'm so sorry. You are not alone.
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