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New Member - Need help/advise (Read 1551 times)
Bryan K.
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New Member - Need help/advise
Dec 23rd, 2009 at 11:57pm
 
Hello everyone!  My name is Bryan, and I just found this site today.  I've been suffering from cluster headaches for about 16 years, although I wasn't fully aware of what my condition was until recently.  I'm 31 years old, married to the most wonderful, supportive wife in the world, and have an amazing 6 month old son as well. 

First, I can't tell you how excited I've been since finding this site today.  For so long, everyone sympothizes with me, but no one has been able to really understand.  It means a lot knowing there are so many of you out there who actually experience the same thing I do (and consiquently, I hate it for all of you at the same time).  I have an extremely supporting family, but having other people who can relate with real experiences mean the world.

I would greatly appreciate any help or advise from anyone here.  PLEASE help!!

My brief cluster background:  I began getting headaches early in high school and was originally diagnosed with migraine headaches after seeing several specialists.  I took muscle relaxers for meds to begin, but that didn't seem to solve my problem.  I switched to pain relievers after that, but that didn't do the trick either.  I tried oral immatrex years ago, but that did as much damage on my stomach as "the beast" did to me.  Over the past several years, I've taken Maxalt as my only medication.

Just the other day I found out about oxygen treatments on the internet.  I had never seen or heard of that before, but am curious to try anything new that might work.  I told my doctor, who knew nothing about it either, but did give me a prescription for a max of 7 liters/minute.  Reading this site now, I see how small that level is.  Unfortunately, the docs are gone for the holidays before I can get it changed.  I just had my tank delivered tonight.

My clusters usually last 4 - 8 weeks, and I usually get one per year.  I typically feel the shadows throughout every day, with a full blown headache at least once or twice a day during the cluster.  I would say I have level 0 - 2 fairly consistent all day long, with my "real" headaches going from a level 3 to level 9 fairly rapidly.  My normal episodes last an hour a piece on average, mostly between level 7 and level 8.  I take Maxalt only at the onset of a "real headache" as I've been terming it.

So a couple of questions:

1.  Do other people here see/like/recomend Maxalt?  Is there another drug, outside of Immitrex (I had a bad experience), that you would recommend instead?

2.  Oxygen seems to be the way to go.  I am learning about it based on other posts at this site.  Should I take Maxalt and use oxygen?

3.  The doctor also prescribed verapamil (3 times daily at 80 mg per).  I also suffer from anxiety, and have read this is a side effect.  Should I take this medication as well?

Sorry for such a LONG post, I'm just new to all of this and am looking for some answers.  My doctors obviously don't know enough about this to help me either.  Any advise or suggestions you could provide would be extremely appreciated.

Thank you all - I look forward to learning and growing with each of you.

Bryan
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Guiseppi
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #1 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:23am
 
A great first post, you have a pretty good handle on the beast! There is a small minority who can get relief from an attack at low delivery rates, so do give it a shot. The trick is for your lungs to get only pure oxygen, no outside air, no exhaled air. If you check out the oxygen info link on the left, it shows the typical set up with a non re breather mask. I suspect you'll need to get a higher flow regulator to have a better chance at succesful aborts. I use a demand valve and can abort an attack in less then 10 minutes.

I've never used maxalt but have seen many people posting success with it. I'm sure they'll be along shortly. The dose of verapamil he has you on is very low. Some have to go as high as 960mg a day to get any relief as a preventative medication. You must work closely with your doc when adjusting this...or any med.....as dangerously low blood pressure can occur. A downer side effect verapamil has for the men who take it, is "little elvis" sometimes has trouble waking up when called to duty. As if the CH isn't punishment enough they have to take THAT away from us! Angry

I use lithium as my prevent, at 1200 mg a day it'll block about 70% of my hits, oxygen handles the break throughs. 

Oral imitrex generally does not work for us as CH builds too fast. Injectable and nasal spray imitrex offer you a better chance at success.

Do get you wife to check out the supporters section on the board. It's where those that care for us can bitch about what a pain in the butt we can be...with other supporters who have been there. My wife has been known to speak of me there! Wink

Glad you found us, keep reading as knowledge is your best weapon against the beast.

joe
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bejeeber
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #2 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:57am
 
Hey Bryan!

It may not matter so much what your doctor writes for liters on the prescription - your O2 supply place likely doesn't have a regulator that goes up high enough anyway, so you may need to order one.

Thats if you want to roll the way so many of do - ignore the prescription and just use the LPM that works for you.

Constant hordes of CH sufferers come on here reporting that oral imitrex is ineffective. This should be common knowledge among doctors but NOoooo.........

Guissepi's got right. Injectible imitrex is the most effective (practically a guaranteed CH killer for many of us), nasal works for some people too.
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CH according to Bejeeber:

Strictly relying on doctors for CH treatment is often a prescription that will keep you in a whole lot of PAIN. Doctors are WAY behind in many respects, and they are usually completely unaware of the benefits of high flow 100% O2.

There are lots of effective treatments documented at this site. Take matters into your own hands, learn as much as you can here and at clusterbusters.com, put it into practice, then tell this CH beast Jeebs said hello right before you bash him so hard with a swift uppercut knockout punch that his stupid horns go flinging right off.
bejeeber bejeeber Enter your address line 1 here  
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saxman
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #3 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:59am
 
Hey Brian, I'm new again to the site! I haven't heard you or anyone mention a prednisone taper!! For me this is the first huge step!!! My first taper stopped the hits and the cycle immediately!!!! Everyone on the site talksabout the side effects/ for me I haven't noticed anything, but who knows!!
I am no CH expert (as I said new like you to the site) BUT!!! if I were you I would get my butt to the ER and get on a pred taper NOW!!! I'm a week into the latest cycle and in a week I have had only one hit!!!
Here's what my taper looks like: 60 mg for 2 days then down 10 mg each 2 days... If you're like me and alot of others on the site you will be PF immediately and have a holiday with your family.
Good luck buddy
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Bryan K.
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #4 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 1:26am
 
Thank you all so much already.  I told my wife I wouldn't hear anything back for a few days with it being after midnight (Eastern time) and it being the holidays.  I never expected to hear back from some of you so soon!  Thank you VERY much!  I have read what a family environment this is, and that is proof in the pudding so to say.  I really, genuinally appreciate that!

I'm trying to digest everything and consider several factors. I feel like the consensus is to go with the oxygen treatment, I just need to get a higher release rate after the holidays.  Because of my anxiety, I am still worried about taking the verapamil, but the low dosage is somewhat encouraging based on the last poster.  The last thing I want is an anxiety attack along with a CH. 

I believe I did hear that my current supplier of the oxygen tank say tonight that they only had regulators that went to 15 liters/minute, so that's good advice.  It looks like I can buy fairly cheap even through this website for something a little more advanced. 

Seriously, thank you all so much already.  I can't tell you how much it means to me and how much I appreciate any and all feedback.  You guys are great and I just hope I can return the favor someday!!!  THANK YOU!  I'll take anything I can get at this point!  Keep them coming if you can.

I'm so happy I found this place, what a relief just to know there are others out there!  And to be able to communicate and share experiences or meds or best practices.  Thank you all again, I'm very much abliged!!!

Bryan
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« Last Edit: Dec 24th, 2009 at 1:39am by Bryan K. »  
 
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Joni
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #5 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 1:31am
 
So a couple of questions:

1.  Do other people here see/like/recomend Maxalt?  Is there another drug, outside of Immitrex (I had a bad experience), that you would recommend instead? 
I have never taken it.  For my last cycle, I use Zyprexa to abort and it did well.  I don't like Imitrex either.


2.  Oxygen seems to be the way to go.  I am learning about it based on other posts at this site.  Should I take Maxalt and use oxygen? 
I don't use either.  Someone else can answer this.


3.  The doctor also prescribed verapamil (3 times daily at 80 mg per).  I also suffer from anxiety, and have read this is a side effect.  Should I take this medication as well? 
I also used a low dose for prevention.  I also have anxiety and didn't notice the Verapamil affecting that.


Sorry for such a LONG post, I'm just new to all of this and am looking for some answers.  My doctors obviously don't know enough about this to help me either.  Any advise or suggestions you could provide would be extremely appreciated.

Thank you all - I look forward to learning and growing with each of you.

Bryan

Your cycles and pattern sound similar to mine.  I have had them for 25 years.  It doesn't sound like you are getting much relief between your headaches.  Try some Red bull for that.  Also, some people here like Melatonin at night.  My head never feels normal during my cycle either.  Actually, my head, neck, ear, eye, and shoulders never feel normal during my cycle.  Wishing you luck!
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Experience:  That most brutal of teachers.  But you learn, my God do you learn.  -C. S. Lewis
 
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pasuranyi
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #6 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:38pm
 
I have tried Maxalt but haven't had any success with it myself, but if it works for you then I suggest continuing to take it!
I have been on Verapamil for about 5 years and never had any anxiety issues from it, and I do have some anxiety. You are on a slightly lower dose than I am, so I think you should be fine, but if you take it and start experiencing more anxiety call your doctor and they can adjust your dose! Don't stop taking it without talking to them first though!
I think the best thing is at the first sign of an attack take the maxalt and then if that doesn't do the trick try the oxygen. It seems like Maxalt works for you, I may have interpreted wrong but I hope it does for you!
Good luck and Happy Holidays!
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Chad
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #7 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:55pm
 
Welcome Bryan!  I'm assuming you're in a cycle now?
I didn't read everybodies post so I maybe repeating some info. 

For the night time, go to a pharmacy today and pick up some Melatonin for a good nights rest.  I take 9mg while in cycle every night.  Rest is super important.  Go grab a 6 pack of Monster/Red Bull/Rock Star or any energy drink with 1000 mg Taurine in it.  Believe it or not, some of us get relief if we chug a drink right at the first sign of an onset.  Get yourself a bag of frozen peas to sooth the pain.  If you do decide to try sumatriptan again, injections is the only way to go.
You won't get a stomach problem either.  Lastly, get on Ebay and get a high flow rate regulator for that tank.  15 LPM or higher helps a lot of folks on here.
That's sweet you doc wrote you a script.  No need to worry about that flow rate.  You can adjust that yourself.  You need to find what works for you.  Read everything on this site and feel free to PM me with any questions.  I check this site everyday.  I'm here to vent while in cycle and support when out of cycle.

Best of luck to you and I wish you pain free days soon!

Happy Holidays!

Chad
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When the PAIN starts, I FIGHT back!

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Chad
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #8 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 12:58pm
 
Bryan K. wrote on Dec 24th, 2009 at 1:26am:
I'm trying to digest everything and consider several factors. I feel like the consensus is to go with the oxygen treatment, I just need to get a higher release rate after the holidays. 
Bryan
How high does your regulator go?  If it goes higher than 7 LPM, crank it up then.
You'll find tons of folks on here who are masters of O2 therapy.  It's the only way.
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When the PAIN starts, I FIGHT back!

Rivea Corymbosa seeds were my KO punch, now D3 is the front runner!
 
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Bryan K.
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #9 - Dec 24th, 2009 at 2:24pm
 
Thanks Chad/all.  I am currently 3 weeks into a cycle, so I should/hopefully be on the downswing (mine typically lst 4 - 6 weeks).    My regulator only goes up to 8 liters/minute.  I tried it for the first time today, but still not sure how to read the results.  I started it with a level 3 headache, used for 15 minutes, and the shadow did go down to a level 2.  That was 20 minutes ago, and as I'm typing now I have no pain.  I just can't tell if I was getting a full blown CH and it really worked, or if I was just having a strong shadow that wasn't going anywhere.  Either way, no more pain, so I'll certainly take that as positive!

I always struggle with when to take medication because I have so many shadows throughout the day.  That Maxalt costs a ton of money, and I can't afford to waste any (Seriously, that stuff costs like $30/pill and insurance only covers 4 pills in a 31 day period).  As I said in an earlier post, I typically have a level 0 -3 constanty all day long.  I've just gotten used to it and deal with that, but I never know when it is going to escalate. 

When they get to a level 4, I take the Maxalt.  Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.  The times my headaches go full blown (usually hovering around a level 8), it takes an average of about an hour a piece with the Maxalt.  That's why I was curious what others thoughts were on Maxalt, and if other people here got positive results or if there are better things to take.  I guess I'm looking for another alternative, because that's just too long to be in agozing pain, and too expensive.  Lots of folks here seem to be on the oxygen/imitrex plan, I just have a lot of reservations about the trex after the experience I had with it.  I swore I would never use it again.  That was years ago and was the oral kind, however. 

Sounds like I need to order a regulator that can get some higher rates.  I really like the idea of oxygen treatment, just need to get the right gear.  I think I'll also give the verapamil a shot, and save the Maxalt for those "emergency" cases.

Thanks to everyone again, I really appreciate all the help!!

MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!!
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Re: New Member - Need help/advise
Reply #10 - Dec 25th, 2009 at 10:50am
 
Bryan,

The first line of defence for CH are triptans and O2. Those are abortive therapies.

The best aspect of oxygen therapy is that you cannot overdose on it. I already posted it elsewhere but
I'll repeat it here: The fuss about the flow rate that physicians and oxygen supply companies make is because of the pulmonary patients as they use it for hours during the day. It does NOT apply to us clusterheads who use it for a very short period of time to abort the attack. It is NOT toxic and high flow rate does not cause any side effects. In other words, don't worry about the flow rate, just crank it up. This site has a lot of good info about the proper use of oxygen. The key is: inhale PURE O2 avoiding leaking of outside air and/or exhaled air and do it rapidly (high flow). You can try to straighten your prescription after the holidays but at best you will be given a regulator that goes up to 15 lpm. Getting a regulator over eBay might be faster and with less hustle. Also, order a mask advertised on this site.

The only triptan officially approved for CH is injectable Imitrex now also available as Sumatriptan Succinate generic (still expansive as hell). The good news about these guys is that they work and they work fast. Even if you are smack in the middle oh Kip 10 and getting ready to blow your brains out, one injection is sufficient to make the pain go away in 10 minutes. Many of CH sufferers here are using "Imitrex tip" and are able to abort the episode with half the dose. Most of us agree that the oral form (pills) is useless. Other triptans are: Maxalt (which is obviously somewhat effective for you but slow), Frova (long lasting but allegedly slow), Zomig nasal spray and fast dissolving pills (I swear by it, slower than Imitrex but long lasting) and couple of more but I have no experience with them. Beware, if you switch between triptans you MUST wait for the previous one to wear off before trying another one. DO NOT combine them.

I will not discuss the preventives (prednisone, verapamil etc.) as my experiences are not typical. The primary reason for this post is to encourage you with the oxygen. First tries can sometimes be unsuccessful and therefore disappointing. It takes awhile to establish what works best. But once you learn what works best for you that green tank will be heaven sent.


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