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Rules? "There Are No Rules..." (Read 12197 times)
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #75 - Mar 24th, 2010 at 12:08pm
 
He knows precisely what he's doing.
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #76 - Mar 24th, 2010 at 1:21pm
 
The most troubling aspect to me is not necessarily the Prince of Fools, but the Sea of Fools that selected this one to be their Prince.
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #77 - Mar 24th, 2010 at 2:29pm
 
Brew wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 1:21pm:
The most troubling aspect to me is not necessarily the Prince of Fools, but the Sea of Fools that selected this one to be their Prince.

you only had 2 choices
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #78 - Mar 24th, 2010 at 4:46pm
 
Quote:
Then we DEREGULATED everything... It was "good" for the American People! B$!!


Same thing in the 20s. They never learn.

Quote:
From the NY Post this morning:


The Rupert Murdoch Post. Now there's an example of that liberal-bias media.... Roll Eyes

As Jay Leno says: "Thank God for Joe Biden!"

The most dangerous thing that could be done in modern times would be to call a convention. Terrifying. Stating that everything directly involves Constitutional law rather than considered deliberation, accompanies most populist movements. It grabs attention and it's the easy way. 

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #79 - Mar 24th, 2010 at 5:20pm
 
-johnny- wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 2:29pm:
Brew wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 1:21pm:
The most troubling aspect to me is not necessarily the Prince of Fools, but the Sea of Fools that selected this one to be their Prince.

you only had 2 choices

That is false.
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Diseases can be our spiritual flat tires - disruptions in our lives that seem to be disasters at the time but end by redirecting our lives in a meaningful way.  ~Bernie S. Siegel
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #80 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 12:12am
 
LasVegas wrote on Mar 23rd, 2010 at 8:22pm:
A  special note to our neighbors: Canada is on List 2.  Since we are likely to be seeing a lot more of each  other, you folks might want to try not pissing us  off for a change.



Canadian troops are fighting and dying alongside US forces in Afghanistan. If you can't respect that, fuck off.

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #81 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 12:58am
 
Easy now.....
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #82 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 1:19am
 


     What Bill said.      Angry Angry Angry
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Hurt people.....hurt people.   Think about it.
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #83 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 7:38am
 
    Muslims and Amish can be exempt from the health care. Along with who knows who else. And this could surprise you how?

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« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2010 at 7:39am by M.R. »  

"Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government." --James Madison

James Taranto  ” [D]o you know what they call people who rely on themselves? Adults."

Thomas Jefferson, "Bind [them] down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution."
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #84 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 12:46pm
 
Good people of Clusterville,

I started this thread to see if any of you perceived the significance of what is happening as I have…  From the comments, some of you recognize the impact the affordable health care legislation will have on all of us.

Unfortunately, now that Obama has signed this egregious bill into law, I don't see the level of situational awareness to recognize this as another milestone in a frightening legislative agenda designed to shred the Constitution, redistribute wealth, take control of the people, and transform our great Nation into a socialist state… 

If you doubt this first statement…  listen to Rep Dingell's (D-MI) comments where he let the truth slip out on the liberal motivation and aspirations driving Obamacare…  Dingell: It will take some time to… "to take the necessary steps to control the people."

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I'll try to explain, offer a prediction and ask a few questions in an attempt to clarify what is happening as I see it…

It's not about affordable health care… It never was…  It's far more devious than that…  It's about destroying the private medical insurance industry, taking over yet another large segment of our economy, and making another large segment of the population welfare dependants of a socialist state.

This isn't the beginning and it won't be the end.  It's part of a hundred year old socialist wet dream and nightmare that's coming true at a frightening pace…  It’s about a carefully orchestrated legislative agenda being carried out by a rogue Congress and a Marxist trained community organizer in the White House. 

All this is being done under the cover of deception and misdirection as their goal is to take over our entire economy, redistribute our wealth, destroy the Constitution and turn America into a socialist state. 

If these lying weasels told you the truth about their goals, you'd call for their impeachment for high crimes and misdemeanors because of their blatant acts of bribery and treason…  then have them charged and convicted for these crimes…  Seeing them do the perp walk in orange jump suits and manacles might be a good deterrent to the remaining America haters…

I can hear the wheels turning… so I'm reminded of the lead-in line and refrain from the song "Ya Got Trouble" from the Music Man…   If you don't remember the lyrics, it goes like this…

" Well… either you're closing your eyes to a situation you do not wish to acknowledge, or you are not aware of the caliber of disaster indicated by the presence of…" and I'll add…  socialists in Congress…  "Oh we got trouble…"

If you doubt what I'm saying…  just look at what's happened so far and look at their agenda of things to come…

Big government liberals have been taking an increased level of control over education for over 130 years…  Obamacare just sealed the deal and took over student tuition loans as the sole provider from Sallie Mae…  The sole provider that is, with the exception of one bank in North Dakota…  Hmmm… Perhaps this bank was a kick back bribe for a "yes" vote on Obamacare?

This Obamacare provision makes a whole new group of indentured people dependant on government and destroys another private industry. 

The home loan and auto industries are now under big government control…  The Fannie and Freddie bail out alone has created a tax liability that could dwarf the cost of Obamacare when home foreclosure rates rise due to the continued unemployment.

The financial industry – banks and thrift institutions - will fall under big government control when the Senate passes Chris Dodd's financial reform bill…  That bill will essentially give the Secretary of the Treasury the power to take over a financial institution "that's too big to fail," fire everyone, and sell off its assets… 

Today when a bank or thrift institution fails the charting authority – the state, revokes the charter, closes the bank and appoints the FDIC, an independent agency of the federal government, as the receiver.   When this bill passes the Senate and is signed into law, the Secretary of the Treasury will have the power to the same thing…  except the kicker here is the Secretary of the Treasury can do this at any time even if the bank or thrift institution hasn't failed…  In short, this power will reside in the executive branch of government…  Another power grab…

Liberals have stymied the US energy industry for well over 35 years and it's in decline with respect to production due to ever increasing big government regulations… The House passed a bill that sets a 17 percent reduction target for U.S. greenhouse gas emissions by 2020 from 2005 levels.  The Senate is working on its version of a similar bill.  When that passes, big government will have a strangle hold on the energy industry…  Thank Al Gore for this one…  And the liberals in big government will start taxing carbon emissions so they can take more of your income as a further instrument of control over your daily life…

The American Recovery And Reinvestment Act (ARRA) OF 2009, a.k.a. the porkulus act laid the groundwork for single payer social medicine with a $36 Billion dollar down payment on an Orwellian computer system and network to automate your medical records.  Provisions in the porkulus also contain the seeds to take over the Internet, the communications industry, and the news media…

My prediction…

Come January 2011 when group medical insurance policies renew, the premiums on these policies will increase anywhere between 50% and 300% to cover State and Federal insurance commission actuarial reserve and high risk pool requirements.... 

This is predictable and it was planned…   It's due to all the Obamacare mandates placed on the evil and greedy medical insurance industry that makes on average, a whopping 3% to 5% profit margin after paying out medical claims, tax and other expenses…  I know… I get the SEC filings on UNH and Aetna in the annual statement for my 301k.   

Guaranteed coverage for pre-existing conditions, the cap on out-of-pocket expenses, dropping the cap on lifetime benefits and allowing children less than 27 years of age (YGBSM) covered on their parent's medical insurance policies will be enough to trigger these increases… 

FYI, I agree with all of these provisions except for children less than 27 years of age and I also understand these provisions come with a cost…  I'd only hoped these costs could have been paid out of the Porkulus… 

When the cost of these insurance premiums go up, the Marxist trained community organizer in the White House and hopefully the lame duck liberal democrats in Congress will howl at the moon and scream…  "We told you the medical insurance companies are evil and greedy… and this is why we need a single payer, government run, social health care system."  More cover and deception…  and there goes the medical health insurance industry with more unemployment…

If you think the liberal democrats passed Obamacare because they care about you and me… think again…  All they really care about is growing a welfare class of people totally dependent on the government entitlements they've enacted…  They do this so they can remain in office and have the power to make decisions for the people.

That’s why they also want to fast-track comprehensive immigration reform to grant amnesty to over 10 million illegal aliens, give them instant citizenship and give them shiny new Obamacare cards paid for with new subsidies…  That's the only way they can stay in office… 

Now ask yourself…  Where is that money coming from to pay for these new instant US citizens?  The answer…  BOHICA and stand by for a value added tax on everything…

You've got to ask… if Obamacare is so great and it's going to be so popular… why are there provisions in this bill, as the CBO points out, that give the IRS $1 Billion extra each year for the next ten years to hire nearly 17,000 new agents to enforce it's mandates?   

These dedicated IRS agents are going to share your tax data with HHS/CMS and they're going to fine you for any non-compliance…  And, if you don't pay the fine, they'll keep any income tax refund you may have coming then they'll go after your checking account and wages…  should you be fortunate enough to have a full time job that pays more than poverty level wages…

These IRS agents are also going to monitor each and every business on a monthly basis to ensure compliance and share that information with CMS as well…   (Orwell was right) so big government now has its hooks into small business…

Now for the rapid fire round:

Does Obamacare increase the number of physicians?   No!

Does Obamacare offer any meaningful tort reform?  No!

Will Obamacare prevent medical insurance premiums from rising?  No!

Will Obamacare make your health care more affordable?  No!

Will Obamacare decrease the wait time to see your PCP?  No!

Will Obamacare increase the cost of doing business? Yes!

Will Obamacare help small businesses with less than 25 employees?  No"

When do we start paying for Obamacare?  You just started when it was signed

When will Obamacare start paying subsidies and entitlements? 2014 - 2018

Will we pay more taxes because of Obamacare? Yes!

When will Obamacare start taxing union Cadillac health care plans?  2018

Will Obamacare make it easier for us to get oxygen therapy?  No…  and here's why…

The Centers for Medicare and Medicaid (CMS) started taking steps in 2009 to reduce coverage for DME Oxygen and oxygen contents for Medicare beneficiaries …  See their own projected spend plan below…  then realize the Medicare cuts that went into effect when the affordable health care bill was signed, will accelerate cuts in the DME Oxygen spend plan.  Some of you may argue that's a problem for us old folks…  and that's true, but, then you'll become one of us soon enough…

However, as coverage determinations made by the CMS bureaucrats form the coverage basis for most of the medical insurance companies and these companies also service Medicaid…  the future availability of coverage for oxygen therapy for cluster headache sufferers is in serious doubt even if you're under 65 and can afford to pay for your own medical insurance.

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The fact that CMS will cut coverage for DME oxygen for Medicare beneficiaries from $1.7 Billion in 2009 to $52 Million in 2014 should get your attention…  Then realize 99.9% of the over 1 million Medicare beneficiaries receiving oxygen therapy are COPD sufferers…  and they're not counting any of the baby boomers turning 65…

As cluster headache sufferers, we don't count… because we're not covered if we happen to be a Medicare beneficiary and don't have a Medicare Advantage or second insurance plan…   and this bill not only cuts over 500 Billion from Medicare funding, it also cuts funding for the Medicare Advantage plans too… 

In case you've not figured it out… DME stands for durable medical equipment…  that will also be subject to additional tax under provisions of Obamacare, but that's only if there are any home care companies near you that deliver your oxygen left in business…  Obamacare jumps ugly on small businesses that provide DME oxygen...

Almost done…

Does anyone really believe Obama and the liberal democrats when they say Obamacare will cut the deficit?    I sure don't.

Spend a few moments looking at the National Debt Clock at the following link: Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

I don't know about you, but it's hard to get my head around numbers this big so I think of it as a debt of $691,000 per family against an average family income of $61,000, and that's far from a comforting thought…

I think we need to face up to the facts… then ask if we can really afford another massive entitlement like Obamacare when Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid are approaching insolvency…

Another factoid from Michelle Bachmann…  from the 15th of October 2008 to the 24th of March 2010, the Federal Government has taken control of 50% of this Nations private economy…    Try to get your head around that!!!

Now for bonus question…  Can we really afford to stand by and let a rogue Congress and a Marxist trained community organizer in the White House continue to execute the Cloward-Piven strategy to destroy our Nation?

In 1966 when I started my career as a Navy pilot, I swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.  For the next 24 years, the cold war enemy was the Soviet Union.  Now the enemy is domestic, in our Congress, they're far left socialists and they're attacking our Constitution… 

That oath I swore remains resolute today…  Accordingly, when the mid-term and presidential elections come around, I intend to use my Constitution right to vote these lying socialist weasels out of office by voting for conservatives… and take back my Government.

Please do your own homework to come up with your own conclusions… then vote…

God Bless America

V/R, Batch
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #85 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 1:14pm
 
Pete ya knows I luvs ya, but you've really got to learn to speak your mind. Smiley

Back in the 60s, I thought segregation was WRONG (had most of my life) and I lived in the SOUTH. I remember the riots, name calling and all the rest that went with that bill... our country was going to hell and our constitution was being trampled upon (and you're old enough to remember that also). We some mighty heated arguments in my parents home about this one.... and I was odd man out on the debate.

Even the churches were preaching against the Civil Rights Bill, but it passed and we all got on with our lives.

This bill has passed - it will be "improved" upon as months and years go by. And we will all get on with our lives.

One thing we can agree on is that Congress needs to be fired (and it don't make me a darn which brand they are - I can't tell the difference any more) and we need some Common Sense folks up there with some "ideas" on how to "improve" things for us folks back home.

But for now, I'm just gonna sit back and write my letters with my "ideas" to the "powers that be" and keep on a writing and see what happens. Been doing that since the third grade -- too old to change my ways now...
Kiss
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #86 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 2:20pm
 
Barbara,

You're right...  Civil Rights caused a deep divide in the 60s...  The big difference here is Obamacare is going to destroy our economy...  cost us more freedoms, and tax the crap out of all of us...  civil rights didn't cost us anything...

My sister works at UC Irvine Healthcare in Orange County as an Authorization/Surgery coordinator... That's a California State run medical facility...  She says the fit has already started hit the shan over the Obamacare cuts in medicare and Medi-Cal (it's broke) with a growing list of benefits that will be denied coverage... 

The first trickle of the deluded and duped public has also started coming through the door asking for their free Obamacare surgery...

The far left liberal democrats and the Marxist trained community organizer have sold Obamacare as a pig in a poke and a chicken on every table...  except there's no pig in the poke and no chicken in the pot... only pig and chicken crap.

Hugs,

V/R, Batch
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« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2010 at 2:21pm by Batch »  

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #87 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 3:18pm
 
Batch wrote on Mar 25th, 2010 at 12:46pm:
(ramble, ramble, ...)

Now for the rapid fire round:

Does Obamacare increase the number of physicians?   No!

...

Please do your own homework to come up with your own conclusions…


Just did my own homework, and found that the reform package does increase funding for educating more nurses and doctors.  So I have to disagree with that statement of yours, along with just about everything else you wrote.  Fact finding is different from generating partisan hysteria, Batchman.
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« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2010 at 3:19pm by monty »  

The outer boundary of what we currently believe is feasible is far short of what we actually must do.
 
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #88 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 3:43pm
 
monty wrote on Mar 25th, 2010 at 3:18pm:
Just did my own homework, and found that the reform package does increase funding for educating more nurses and doctors.  So I have to disagree with that statement of yours, along with just about everything else you wrote.  Fact finding is different from generating partisan hysteria, Batchman.

So I can add you to my thank-you list when these chickens come home to roost?

Thanks for the heads-up.
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #89 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 5:02pm
 
Batch wrote on Mar 25th, 2010 at 12:46pm:
Good people of Clusterville,

I started this thread to see if any of you perceived the significance of what is happening as I have... 

to recognize this as another milestone in a frightening legislative agenda ...

... that's coming true at a frightening pace...



As a new elected Democratic president made his way to the White House, the opposing political candidate lay asleep stretched in full length on the sofa in his melancholy home as his wife paced, a visitor recalled.  Thin and white, covered from head to foot with a dark cloak, which looked like a black pall.  Uncertainty of the future increased official gloom.  A friend penned: 

"... My opinion is
That when he comes he will bring a breeze with him.
Which way it will blow, I cannot tell. ...
My fear is stronger than ...


As perceived, I'll check under the bed tonight.  Thanks. 




The 80's secular evangelist style, like marketing a reintroduced Pacer as the "now" luxury car, has associative tangents.

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« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2010 at 5:33pm by Kevin_M »  
 
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #90 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 6:43pm
 
Whew.

When it comes to "shredding" the Constitution, George Bush rewrote the script.

Charlie
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« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2010 at 6:44pm by Charlie »  

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #91 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 8:30pm
 
Charlie wrote on Mar 25th, 2010 at 6:43pm:
Whew.

When it comes to "shredding" the Constitution, George Bush rewrote the script.

Charlie

How so, compared to what's going on right now?
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #92 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 8:52pm
 
I don't have a problem with a well written reform of health care in this country, if the people are for it.  However this was neither well written nor are the people for it.

I can only hope they fix as many problems as they can QUICKLY!!!!
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #93 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 9:51pm
 
"I will not sign a bill if it adds one dime to the deficit, now or in the future, period."
-Barack Obama-

How can this be said over and over when we can't even pay for the entitlements currently in place?

Can someone please elevate my hopes and name me a few endeavors taken on by the US Government that was not plagued with enormous cost overruns or involved deficit spending. Please, please tell me.

I guess we're going to find out. Trouble is if this thing goes badly it's going to go real bad...and oops ain't going to get it.

Steve G

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #94 - Mar 25th, 2010 at 10:37pm
 
Hey Monty,

Thanks for the comments…  I'd only hoped you would have come up with something a little more challenging...  But then at least you took the bait...

You're absolutely correct…  There is funding for new doctors… 

The ARRA 2009 a.k.a. porculus authorized $300 million to the National Health Service Corps to Support Health Professions Educational Loan Repayment and Scholarships for doctors, dentists, nurses, and medical technicians… for 2009... see page 129 -131 Subtitle B—Health and Human Services sub para (4)... 

"(4) $600,000,000, of which $300,000,000 shall not be available until October 1, 2009, shall be for the training of nurses and primary care physicians and dentists as authorized under titles VII and VIII of the PHS Act, for the provision of health care personnel under the National Health Service Corps program authorized under title III of the PHS Act, and for the patient navigator program authorized undertitle III of the PHS Act.

Assuming this attracts more potential doctors to attend medical school, and at least half of the $300 Million is used by medical school applicants, that works out to 800 new doctors in the National Health Service Corps at an average cost of $186,000 to complete medical school…

Page 1295-1296 of the 24 Dec 2009 Senate version of Obamacare provides the following:

b) PROGRAM ADMINISTRATION.—Through the program established under this section, the Secretary shall enter into contracts with qualified health professionals  (Doctors, RNs, Med Techs) under which—

(1) such qualified health professionals will agree to provide pediatric medical subspecialty, pediatric surgical specialty, or child and adolescent mental and behavioral health care in an area with a shortage of the specified pediatric subspecialty that has a sufficient pediatric population to support such pediatric subspecialty, as determined by the Secretary; and

(2) the Secretary agrees to make payments on the principal and interest of undergraduate, graduate, or graduate medical education loans of professionals described in paragraph of not more than $35,000 a year for each year of agreed upon service under such paragraph for a period of not more than 3 years during the qualified health professional’s

‘‘(A) participation in an accredited pediatric medical subspecialty, pediatric surgical specialty, or child and adolescent mental health subspecialty residency or fellowship; or

‘‘(B) employment as a pediatric medical subspecialist, pediatric surgical specialist, or child and adolescent mental health professional serving an area or population described in such paragraph.

Putting all this in perspective...  There were 16,468 matriculants from US medical schools in the 2008-2009 time frame…  (AAMC DW:Student, as of September 1, 2009 - AAMC FACTS website, Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register).

So… assuming 4 years to complete medical school (and that's a low-ball estimate) and 3+ years to complete Internship/Residency requirements (plus 1 to 2 years fellowship if you want a trained neurologist or surgeon) and they pass all the "boards…" the ARRA could be responsible for the delivery of 800 new doctors by 2018…  IF they start medical school this fall… and you are authorized to receive medical care from the National Health Service Corps... i.e. the VA, NIH, and the Military Service Hospitals... 

The Obamacare legislation is a little more vague but the bottom line is clear…   If the Secretary of HHS agrees, and the physician is willing to relocate to an area underserved by pediatricians, Obamacare will pay off loans at a rate of not more than $35,000/year for not more than three years for physicians who want to specialize in pediatrics…  but this provision is kind of fuzzy as it gives no limits on the total authorization authority or the number of recipients... only that it ends after the third year… 

and I'm positive that Obamacare is not going to let you and me go to a pediatrician for our health care...

What I can say is that princess Pelosi is Not the most powerful woman in the US Government…  it's "Abort'em All" Kathleen Gilligan Sebelius…  the Secretary of Health and Human Services… 

A review of the Senate version of Obamacare indicates over 2000 instances of "The Secretary – (of Health and Human Services)… shall…"

This little lady is going to be jumping faster that a grasshopper on an anthill with all the tasks Obamacare has laid on her…

Then there's the statistics on doctors leaving medical practice…  and these are a bit fuzzy, but it's clear the trend is up…  They're bailing out like rats deserting a sinking ship...  One survey of US physicians I looked at indicated only 18% planned to continue a full time private medical practice past the age of 50…

With the average cost of malpractice insurance between $20,000 and $200,000 per year depending on the state…  near as I can figure after running the numbers… most new physicians in private practice end up working at an effective take home salary after taxes…  not much better than the average McDonald's day manager's wages their first few years in medical practice…

Accordingly… I'll stand by my original statement…  You and I are not going to see the number of doctors that treat us increase any time soon… 

Moreover, when the 32 million new Obamacare recipients begin to demand their entitlements starting in 2014 along with the 10 to 15 million illegal aliens that the Marxist trained community organizer and rogue congress grant amnesty with instant citizenship so they can have a shiny new Obamacare card...  You and I will be blocks away waiting in line for a very long time...  to see a doctor.

Take care all...  and BOHICA…  the silly reconciliation of Obamacare just passed the House... and they've still got to fund an additional $200 Billion for the "Medicare Doctor Fix"...

Hmmm...  looks like that $170 Billion cut in the deficit by 2018 will be more like a $2.5 Trillion increase in the deficit...  so the Marxist trained community organizer and rogue Congress lied. What else is new?

And Kevin... just make sure the wind at your backside is not your own when you check under the bed...

V/R, Batch

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Kevin_M
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #95 - Mar 26th, 2010 at 2:40am
 
Batch wrote on Mar 25th, 2010 at 10:37pm:
... just make sure the wind at your backside is not your own when you check under the bed...


I closed this window, all was clear.  No dust from the 80's.
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BarbaraD
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #96 - Mar 26th, 2010 at 6:06am
 
The fact is that the Bill has passed and now it would behove us all to write, call, e-mail or fax our "representatives" suggestions to IMPROVE it. And it does need improving in a lot of areas. But instead of calling each other names and wasting a lot of hot air, why not suggest improvements to make it WORK better.

Right now I'm looking at things from a personal point of view. My son's company cancelled insurance for employees so they're dependent upon his wife's insurance to cover them and she's really wanting to quit and find other employment, but can't because of the insurance on the kids. One child has a "little" problem and it would (up until Tuesday) been a problem getting a policy if she did quit. Now she doesn't have to worry about "pre-existing" condition on the baby. To me that's worth a lot (I spent years without any insurance because of CH, so I know what it's like NOT to be able to be sick).

And as far as the deficit goes -- didn't putting the costs of the WAR (which have been convenietly left out for years) in the budget kinda raise that?

I'm not crazy about the "mandated" clause in the Bill, but a lot of states have that already (I think there's about 10 or 12 that do) just like they do with car insurance. The argument is - is it constitutional for the feds to tell the states that they have to mandate it.... guess the courts will decide that, but the states that have it are working out fine from what I understand.

And we're paying for the illegals as it is (in the ERs). I don't agree with that, but I didn't read where they'll be covered in this bill.

And I think after 40 years in Congress they should give some of those guys a gold watch and a nice "thank you" go home!  Kiss
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #97 - Mar 26th, 2010 at 7:33am
 
Quote:
Come January 2011

Throw the crowd a few loaves of bread up front and hit them with the pay part a month after the elections.  Do ya think that was planned?
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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #98 - Mar 26th, 2010 at 7:46am
 
Quote:
A mandate requiring all individuals to purchase health insurance would be an unprecedented form of federal action. The government has never required people to buy any good or service as a condition of lawful residence in the United States. An individual mandate would have two features that, in combination, would make it unique. First, it would impose a duty on individuals as members of society. Second, it would require people to purchase a specific service that would be heavily regulated by the federal government.[1]

This statement from a 1994 Congressional Budget Office Memorandum remains true today.

Read the whole thing at:

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Re: Rules? "There Are No Rules..."
Reply #99 - Mar 26th, 2010 at 8:41am
 
BarbaraD.
To my knowledge (and limited research on the matter),  MA is the only state that REQUIRES coverage.

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For those of you that are looking for immediate relief, best hold on.

The Wall Street Journal developed a timeline of the various provisions of the bill:

2010

Coverage

Subsidies begin for small businesses to provide coverage to employees.
Insurance companies barred from denying coverage to children with pre-existing illness.
Children permitted to stay on their parents’ insurance policies until their 26th birthday.

2011

Coverage

Set up long-term care program under which people pay premiums into system for at least five years and become eligible for support payments if they need assistance in daily living.
Taxes and fees

Drug makers face annual fee of $2.5 billion (rises in subsequent years).

2013

Taxes and fees

New Medicare taxes on individuals earning more than $200,000 a year and couples filing jointly earning more than $250,000 a year.
Tax on wages rises to 2.35% from 1.45%.
New 3.8% tax on unearned income such as dividends and interest.
Excise tax of 2.3% imposed on sale of medical devices.
Cost control

Medicare pilot program begins to test bundled payments for care, in a bid to pay for quality rather than quantity of services.

2014

Coverage

Create exchanges where people without employer coverage, as well as small businesses, can shop for health coverage. Insurance companies barred from denying coverage to anyone with pre-existing illness.
Requirement begins for most people to have health insurance. Subsidies begin for lower and middle-income people. People at 133% of federal poverty level pay maximum of 3% of income for coverage. People at 400% of poverty level pay up to 9.5% of income. (Poverty level currently is about $22,000 for a family of four.)
Medicaid, the federal-state program for the poor, expands to all Americans with income up to 133% of federal poverty level.
Subsidies for small businesses to provide coverage increase. Businesses with 10 or fewer employees and average annual wages of less than $25,000 receive tax credit of up to 50% of employer’s contribution. Tax credits phase out for larger businesses.
Taxes and fees

Employers with more than 50 employees that don’t provide affordable coverage must pay a fine if employees receive tax credits to buy insurance. Fine is up to $3,000 per employee, excluding first 30 employees.
Insurance industry must pay annual fee of $8 billion (rises in subsequent years).
Cost control

Independent Medicare board must begin to submit recommendations to curb Medicare spending, if costs are rising faster than inflation.

2016

Taxes and fees

Penalty for those who don’t carry coverage rises to 2.5% of taxable income or $695, whichever is greater.

2017

Coverage

Businesses with more than 100 employees can buy coverage on insurance exchanges, if state permits it.

2018

Taxes and fees

Excise tax of 40% imposed on health plans valued at more than $10,200 for individual coverage and $27,500 for family coverage
As we move toward the 2010 midterm elections, be assured: passage of this bill will play a prominent role in each party’s election strategy.

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Other changes in 2010

Also, individuals that have not had health insurance for 6 months will receive a subsidy to enroll in high-risk insurance pools run by the states.  (Hope those subsidies are very good.  Currently my daughter is in the high risk pool run by the state.  Her insurance costs $2400.00 a year, with a $2500 deductible for medical and $250 for pharmacy).  Then it pays at 80%.

In 2014, the majority of Americans will gain benefits from the new health care bill.

So, the way I read this, we will be paying for 4 years before any significant gains are made.
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