Click this link to read a post I like on the clusterheadaches.com message board...

Batch

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Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Nov 24^th, 2010 at 5:48pm

The attached is a good read...

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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Cluster_Headache_Oxygen_Survey_Article_J_of_HEADACHE_and_Pain_Management_Nov_Dec_2010.pdf (Attachment deleted)

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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Guiseppi CH.com Moderator CH.com Alumnus Offline San Diego to Florida 05-16-2011 Posts: 12063 SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA USA Gender:	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #1 - Nov 24^th, 2010 at 6:11pm And a debt of gratitude we owe you for all your work on this Batch! Joe
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Mike NZ

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #2 - Nov 25^th, 2010 at 1:53am

Great reading and I'm sure this will be very useful for people trying to educate their doctors or insurance companies that oxygen really does work.

Now I'd love to see a paper on how effective high flow rates are. In the paper there were plenty of people who were not pain free at 15 or 20 minutes and yet there are plenty of people here using 25lpm or higher who are consistently pain free in 6-8 minutes.

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Batch

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #3 - Nov 25^th, 2010 at 12:13pm

Mike,

The paper on oxygen therapy at flow rates that support hyperventilation will come in due time following Dr. Rozen's study of the Demand Valve Method of Oxygen Therapy as an Abortive for Cluster Headache.

I drove up to Wilkes-Barre, PA two weeks ago to train the study coordinator and assistants at the Geisinger Center for Clinical Trials that will run this study for Dr. Rozen.

You should have seen their eyes when they finally realized what happens when you hyperventilate with 100% oxygen. This wasn't anything they've done before and nothing like the 7 to 12 liters/minute generally prescribed for the acute treatment of cluster headache... They all demonstrated the Demand Valve Method of Therapy procedures correctly and to a person said "Wow!!!" when they were done.

Take care,

V/R, Batch

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You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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Mike NZ

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #4 - Nov 25^th, 2010 at 2:56pm

Great news Batch and excellent work.

It's research like this that will make a huge impact in many people's lives. It just needs to then filter down to those neurologists and other doctors that this really is the most effective way to use oxygen.

However I was told by an oxygen service person a couple of days ago that using 15lpm oxygen was very dangerous as it would "make my blood boil". He was very confused and worried that I've a 25lpm regulator. But I was able to use information you've posted, specifically about how US Navy pilots use oxygen for hours at a time at higher flow rates with no problems.

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George CH.com Moderator CH.com Alumnus Offline Black-Billed Magpie Posts: 8126 Boise, Idaho USA Gender:	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #5 - Nov 26^th, 2010 at 1:40am A VERY interesting read, Pete. Thank you for posting this. Best wishes, George
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itotka CH.com Old Timer Offline Oxygen Posts: 465 Budapest\|Solar System Gender:	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #6 - Nov 27^th, 2010 at 11:49am Thanks for your work, Bro!
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wimsey1

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #7 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 10:52am

Hey Pete, thanks, not just for this paper but for all of the work you put in and the compassionate help you offer. Having read the paper I was wondering two things: one you've already mentioned about hyperventilating at much higher flow rates. The other is this:

Quote:

Overall the CH survey responders suggested that
inhaled oxygen is fairly slow to have an abortive
effect as 49% noted that they needed over 21 minutes
to completely stop a headache.

So, I'm not arguing with the data (except I found using your breathing technique and a flow rate of 25lpm or more greatly reduced abort time), but I am arguing with what this quote suggests. Even when I was using O2 less ineffectively, I felt immediate relief and was able to handle the pain without reaching for my gun. I mean the relief was instantaneous even if the abort was not. This meant a world of difference and hope for me. The study doesn't seem to have covered that part. Or am I the only one who found O2 helped manage the attack and the pain while it brought about a drug free abort?

Thanks again, Pete. Fair winds and following seas! lance

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mikstudie CH.com Old Timer Offline Beastmaster Posts: 284 Westland Mi. Gender:	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #8 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:42pm I was not happy with the first page where it states "welders oxygen may be harmful to it's user" ?????
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Brew CH.com Sponsor CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 14163	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #9 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:48pm mikstudie wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:42pm: I was not happy with the first page where it states "welders oxygen may be harmful to it's user" ????? What else do you expect a doctor to say? This is one of those "wink, wink, nudge, nudge, know what I mean, say no more" topics for us insiders.
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mikstudie CH.com Old Timer Offline Beastmaster Posts: 284 Westland Mi. Gender:	Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took Reply #10 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:57pm I hear ya Brew,this is just one of those things that a new o2 user (like myself) is paranoid about. Iam sure iam not the only one that worries about this.
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Mike NZ

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #11 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 2:18pm

mikstudie wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:42pm:

I was not happy with the first page where it states "welders oxygen may be harmful to it's user"

Remember that this is a scientific paper. There are three options as to the effect of welding oxygen compared to medical oxygen:

Welding oxygen is more beneficial than medical - that would need a trial to prove and it's likely to be very hard to get a statistically significant result.
Welding oxygen is exactly as beneficial as medical - again this would be hard to prove
Welding oxygen is not as beneficial as medical - this too would be hard to prove

Given that the difference in purity of welding and medical oxygen is very, very small it's almost certain that for aborting CHs there is no significant difference. However proving it in a scientific paper needs a degree of proof.

It's a bit like with ~~global warming~~ climate change, there are two options:

The earth's climate is not changing
The earth's climate is changing

The first is plainly not true otherwise we'd not have weather, seasons, etc., which pretty much proves that the climate is changing (without attributing why).

For me, I'm using medical, but if I didn't have access to it I'd use welding.

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wimsey1

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Re: Paper on Cluster Headache Survey Many of Us Took
Reply #12 - Nov 30^th, 2010 at 8:12am

Quote:

It's a bit like with global warming climate change, there are two options:

•The earth's climate is not changing
•The earth's climate is changing

The first is plainly not true otherwise we'd not have weather, seasons, etc., which pretty much proves that the climate is changing (without attributing why).

Heh! One of my favorite non-topics!

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