Click this link to read a post I like on the clusterheadaches.com message board...

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:16pm

to follow up on my previous posts...my husband's doctor just said he should stop taking the Imitrex injections (and hopefully that will clear up this constant headache he's had for the pats 6 days). He's to continue the prednisone.

Also he's prescribing:
Ativan - I guess an anti-anxiety medicine, but he called it like a pill form of alcohol (that worries me)
Percocet (he said to try to take the edge off of the headache)
Topomax (he said it's the preventive to start now , and the doseage will increase next week)

-He also put in a request for a MRI.
-He put in a request for O2 as well but..when he was talking about it he mentioned nasal canula or mask. And he said it will be at a high-flow rate of 6-8lpm. (Which from what I've read on here, is way too low.)

On the oxygen - we can just get a regular or (I forget the actual terms, sorry) something else to increase the rate, right? or is that completely wrong?

From what I've read here, no painkillers help clusterheadaches. Should he even try the percocet? and does anyone have experience with Ativan?

I had him put in another referral to get a second opinion on treatment, just so we start to get into the system to see another doctor even if it will take a while...hopefully something will work soon. I think I'm going to go ahead and get the welder's oxygen for him though because who knows how long getting the oxygen being prescribed will take.

anyway, any suggestions on the above?

Back to top

IP Logged

Potter CH.com Alumnus Offline Team MOOSE DROOL Stinky Stuff on a Hook Prostaff Posts: 3600 Blgs.Mt. Gender:	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #1 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:26pm I thought we already gave you the scoop on oxygen. Potter
Back to top	IP Logged

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #2 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:32pm

I guess I was just trying to ask specifically if a doctor puts in the request for 6-8lpm, if there is a way to get around it. (I've read so many posts and articles I know it needs to be higher than that but it's been such a whirlwind of information I'll re-read the other posts..).

edit - ok, yep found the post i was looking for about the oxygen prescription:) thanks! i'm going to go ahead and buy another regulator and non-rebreather mask to be ready.

still interested in what anyone has to say about the percocet and ativan...

Back to top

« Last Edit: Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:55pm by krys »

IP Logged

Batch

CH.com Alumnus

Offline

Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must

Posts: 3708
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #3 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 2:28pm

Krys,

It's obvious your husband's doctor knows little about cluster headaches and it appears he's working out of an old cookbook for treating migraines.

The question "Do you want a nose cannula or mask" and an oxygen flow rate of "6 to 8 liters/minute" tells us he knows little about using oxygen therapy as an acute treatment for CH.

The Rx should read as shown in the following:

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!! You need to

or

You'll notice there's no mention of ativan or percocet in the above EFNS standard of care chart in the recommended treatment of cluster headache. Ativan and percocet will do nothing to stop a cluster headache. Percocet is a mix of acetaminophen and oxycodone. And, as oxycodone is an opiate, it's addictive. At best oxycodone will only take the edge off the pain.

We've folks around here who were prescribed morphine injections, a far more powerful opiate for their CH. They still had 6 to 8 CH a day/night and in the end, all that did was make them dependent on morphine. If your husband thinks CH are bad ask him if he's willing to go through detox/withdrawal and have CH at the same time... That makes for a very unhappy camper...

As you've already asked for a referral, at least push this doctor for a properly written Rx for oxygen therapy. The key words are "Oxygen at a flow rate of 12 to 15 liters/minute with non-rebreathing oxygen mask for cluster headache."

If "Cluster Headache" is not specified in the Rx as the condition being treated, the home oxygen therapy folks will balk thinking the oxygen is for COPD and send you back for oxygen saturation levels.

Check your PM.

V/R, Batch

Back to top

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

IP Logged

Karla

CH.com Alumnus

Offline

One of Many and Never
Alone - Join OUCH

Posts: 3837
x1|Madison WI USA
Gender: female

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #4 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 3:01pm

I take ativan for severe anxiety issues. It makes me real tired after I take it and I sleep for a couple of hours. This is on a low dose of it. It doesnt make me high or loopy. You should not drink alcahol with it you could overdose. It does nothing for ch.

I also have taken percacet and vicadin at seperate times thouout my journey of trying to treat ch. I was perscribed high doses 20-40mg of oxycodone which is percacet without the tylanol in it. It helped bring the level of ch down from a 10 to a 7 or 8 but over all in the end I was taking handfulls of pills and getting little relief for the effort.

Oxygen and a preventative and imitrix as a backup incase the oxygen fails is the key in treatment.
I would recomend you find a different doctor who will perscribe what you need and knows more about ch. Good luck!

Back to top

Karla&&suffer chronic ch &&ch.com groupie since 1999&&Proud Mom of Chris USMC Semper Fi

IP Logged

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #5 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 3:48pm

Karla wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 3:01pm:

I take ativan for severe anxiety issues. It makes me real tired after I take it and I sleep for a couple of hours. This is on a low dose of it. It doesnt make me high or loopy. You should not drink alcahol with it you could overdose. It does nothing for ch.

I also have taken percacet and vicadin at seperate times thouout my journey of trying to treat ch. I was perscribed high doses 20-40mg of oxycodone which is percacet without the tylanol in it. It helped bring the level of ch down from a 10 to a 7 or 8 but over all in the end I was taking handfulls of pills and getting little relief for the effort.

Oxygen and a preventative and imitrix as a backup incase the oxygen fails is the key in treatment.
I would recomend you find a different doctor who will perscribe what you need and knows more about ch. Good luck!

I think the Ativan is mostly to lower his anxiety and try to help him sleep..he hasn't slept more than 3 hours a night (total) in the last few weeks..

I'm hesitant for him to try the percocet..I'm just not sure there's enough benefit to taking them when compared with the risks..

Back to top

IP Logged

Callico CH.com Hall of Famer Offline Author of "Stranded at Romson's Lodge Posts: 4916 Aurora IL Gender:	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #6 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:08pm Percocet is worthless for CH. It can also be quite addictive. Been there, don't want to go back. Went with absolutely nothing except coffee for almost 20 years because of it. Some don't have issues with it, but some are able to charm snakes too. Jerry
Back to top	"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of dung by the clean end." Texas A&M Student (unknown) IP Logged

seaworthy CH.com Hall of Famer Offline Posts: 706	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #7 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:00pm Quote: I'm hesitant for him to try the percocet..I'm just not sure there's enough benefit to taking them when compared with the risks.. Not to mention that it can be a sure fire trigger. Find a new Doc.
Back to top	IP Logged

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #8 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:11pm

seaworthy wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:00pm:

Quote:

I'm hesitant for him to try the percocet..I'm just not sure there's enough benefit to taking them when compared with the risks..

Not to mention that it can be a sure fire trigger.

Find a new Doc.

We're definitely working on getting a new doctor.

Back to top

IP Logged

QnHeartMM

CH.com Sponsor

Offline

I AM a Phoenix!

Posts: 1783
San Diego, CA
Gender: female

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #9 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:12pm

Has anyone mentioned Melatonin to you Krys? That has helped others with sleep. I'm not exactly sure on the dosages but if you do a search on the word I'm sure some other threads will pop up.

Edited to add: Of course if he's using the Activan - and it works - he probably should not also use Melatonin. But if Activan doesnt work, and he discontinues using it, then perhaps Melatonin.

Back to top

« Last Edit: Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:13pm by QnHeartMM »

Treat people with kind words.

IP Logged

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #10 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:46pm

QnHeartMM wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:12pm:

Has anyone mentioned Melatonin to you Krys? That has helped others with sleep. I'm not exactly sure on the dosages but if you do a search on the word I'm sure some other threads will pop up.

Edited to add: Of course if he's using the Activan - and it works - he probably should not also use Melatonin. But if Activan doesnt work, and he discontinues using it, then perhaps Melatonin.

Yep, he's been taking around 10mg of Melatonin a night.

Back to top

IP Logged

krys CH.com Junior Offline I Love CH.com! Posts: 44 DC/VA	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #11 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 8:28pm so i guess he took antivan and percocet this afternoon. the constant headache he's had is still here, the percocet didn't help. and now he is even more out of it than before...and he is dreading another attack... apparently side effects for both medicines include depression and suicidal thoughts...
Back to top	IP Logged

Brew CH.com Sponsor CH.com Alumnus Offline Posts: 14163	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #12 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 8:33pm He needs to get off that merry-go-round but quick. Follow Batch's advice. If you can't find a doc that will prescribe O2, get your own from a welding shop.
Back to top	"I have been asked if I have changed in these past 25 years. No, I am the same. Only more so." --Ayn Rand IP Logged

Bob P CH.com Hall of Famer Offline Shut up Bob! Posts: 4573 Clio,California Gender:	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #13 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 8:20am O2 at 8 lpm will work well for some. Others have better success at higher levels. I'm 6'4", 230 lbs. and can abort an attack in less than 10 minutes at 8 lpm, with the attack never getting above a K5 during the abort.
Back to top	Mrs. Barlow, I never, and I repeat never, ever pissed in your steam iron. "SHUT UP HUB!" IP Logged

Skyhawk5

CH.com Alumnus

Offline

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1320
Ypsilanti, Mi. USA
Gender: male

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #14 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 7:03pm

The most important thing is to get the O2, many suppliers use 15lpm regulators, if not you can get your own reg and mask for reasonble cost, if the Doc won't change the RX.

It's all too common for Doctors, Neurologists also, to know limited info about the best treatments for CH. Educating ourselves about this is in our own best interest.

Wishing you the best of luck, Don

Back to top

Though I walk through the valley of the shadow of the Beast , I have O2 so I fear him not.

IP Logged

Linda_Howell

CH.com Moderator
CH.com Alumnus

Offline

Do not feed the Moderators

Posts: 11927
Santa Maria, Ca.
Gender: female

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #15 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 7:53pm

Quote:

Percocet is worthless for CH. It can also be quite addictive.

I whole-hearedly approve this message above. You can also add Vicodin, Morphine, as well as numerous other narcotics. Besides the addiction side of it....it will also cause rebounds froim hell. Please tell him to stay away from it and as his supporter...get him a knowledgable doctor.

BobP above knows his stuff and if he says 8 lpm of 02 worked for him I believe him. HIOWEVER..most of us need more than that. I started out with 15 and several yrs. ago I recieved a 25 lpm regulator and the difference was astronomical. I can abort in less than 10 mins. if I get on it soon enough.

I just love it when supporters come ion here trying to get info and support for their spouses. It would saem you are one of those and I salute you and I hope you know how important you are to him.

Big hugs to you. Linda

Back to top

Hurt people.....hurt people. Think about it.

IP Logged

Melby29

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 91

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #16 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 10:42pm

Krys, I feel for your husband (and you!), I have just been on the whole run-around with a stupid, ignorant neuro and an unknowledgeable (but at least caring) GP. I ended up having to get a friend to STEAL an O2 tank so I could try it. And I've used so many painkillers this last 4 months - paracetamol, ibuprofen, codeine, tramadol - all by the truckload - that I'm sure my liver and kidneys would be shot, with only the tramadol making a slight scrap of difference.

So yeah, take everyone's advice, do whatever you need to do to get your hubby some O2 and the equipment that goes with it. I'm not great with my technique, and I often get re-hit after an hour or so, but at least I get some respite and the re-hits are milder.

Good luck and I hope your hubby realises that he is VERY lucky to have someone so caring and supporting, willing to carry some of the burden for him.

Back to top

IP Logged

krys

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 44
DC/VA

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #17 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 10:52pm

thanks for the advice, everyone. we're going to try to get an oxygen prescription pushed through as fast as possible, but i think i'll go ahead and order the welders oxygen for him since we're not sure how long it will take to go through. (it has to get an approval in tricare somewhere..so..who knows. i'd rather be safe and go ahead and get the welders oxygen.)

he, knock on wood, hasn't had one of the more severe attacks in the last almost 48 hours now. (he's in the hospital now, so i'm not sure about the last few hours, i hope he hasn't had one though.) the oxygen has lessened the pain of the constant (maybe chronic) headache he's had for the last week though..some of the abstracts i've read were about something similar, cluster-like headaches plus a chronic headache. maybe this is an ignorant question (or maybe exhaustion that i don't remember) but is it normal for oxygen to help headaches that aren't cluster headaches? it comes back shortly after he stops breathing in the O2...

Back to top

IP Logged

Melby29

CH.com Junior

Offline

I Love CH.com!

Posts: 91

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #18 - Mar 2^nd, 2011 at 11:53pm

This may be an ignorant answer (because I'm new too!!) but my understanding is that no, it doesn't help other headaches. I base this on 2 things - 1) my headache specialist seemed to put a lot of weight on the fact that I had tried O2 and it worked, when he made my CH diagnosis. 2) I had a spinal tap (for something unrelated) a few weeks ago, and had some headaches that were related to that. They were different headaches (when I bent over, coughed etc and would then linger) but just to be sure, I tried the O2, which did absolutely NOTHING.

Plus my understanding of the whole vascular constriction thing - other headaches don't have the same physiology that would react to O2 in the same way (or do migraines?????)

Anyway.... I'm sure a smarter person will be along soon. In the meantime.... don't take my advice too seriously.... but for now I will pretend I am really really smart.....

Back to top

IP Logged

Bob P CH.com Hall of Famer Offline Shut up Bob! Posts: 4573 Clio,California Gender:	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #19 - Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 7:59am I've heard mention of using O2 for hangover headaches.
Back to top	Mrs. Barlow, I never, and I repeat never, ever pissed in your steam iron. "SHUT UP HUB!" IP Logged

Batch

CH.com Alumnus

Offline

Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must

Posts: 3708
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male

Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone)
Reply #20 - Mar 4^th, 2011 at 1:55am

Bob,

It doesn't work... and I won't embarrass myself with the number of times I tried it as a young fighter pilot.

That's why it didn't take long to learn and respect the time proven adage... "No smoking within 50 feet of the aircraft and 24 hours bottle to throttle."

When the jet is moving at 10 miles a minute and the brain at 3, you're so far behind the jet you're just along for the ride instead of having more fun than you can imagine with your clothes on... Wink

Take care,

V/R, Batch

Back to top

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

IP Logged

wimsey1 CH.com Alumnus Offline I Love CH.com! Posts: 2457 MA Gender:	Re: Ativan, Percocet and Topomax (plus prednisone) Reply #21 - Mar 4^th, 2011 at 7:09am Some have posted that O2 has been helpful with their migraine headaches. lance
Back to top	IP Logged

	Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
	Search box updated Dec 3, 2011... Search ch.com with Google!