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Bobbyd CH.com Junior Offline I Love CH.com! Posts: 30 Boston, MA Gender:	Question about D3 Aug 18^th, 2013 at 7:47am I am starting D3 today. Is there any obvious pitfalls I should avoid? For instance taking it in the AM or PM, avoid milk, etc? Any help is much appreciated. How about obvious issues with other meds if any? Verapamil?
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maz CH.com Hall of Famer Offline I Love CH.com! Posts: 1071 Hampshire, England Gender:	Re: Question about D3 Reply #1 - Aug 18^th, 2013 at 9:20am Hi, I split mine in two. Half mid morning and the other half with my evening meal. I feel very slightly nauseous when I've taken it which may be a lot worse if taken all at once. That said, the nausea is very slight and nothing compared to CH. Good luck with it. Maz.
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Hoppy CH.com Alumnus Offline LAUGHTER IS THE BEST MEDICINE Posts: 1890 Perth WA Gender:	Re: Question about D3 Reply #2 - Aug 18^th, 2013 at 3:45pm Hi Bobby, You need to take the verapamil first thing in the morning then the D3 Regime at night with your main meal. Verapamil needs at least a 7hr gap. Hoppy.
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Bobbyd CH.com Junior Offline I Love CH.com! Posts: 30 Boston, MA Gender:	Re: Question about D3 Reply #3 - Aug 18^th, 2013 at 4:52pm I take the Verapamil 3X daily, any thoughts?
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Hoppy CH.com Alumnus Offline LAUGHTER IS THE BEST MEDICINE Posts: 1890 Perth WA Gender:	Re: Question about D3 Reply #4 - Aug 18^th, 2013 at 5:20pm Bobby, taking calcium supplements with verapamil can lower verapamil effectiveness so it's best to take the verapamil in the morning. Maybe talk this over with your doctor. Hoppy.
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Mike NZ

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #5 - Aug 19^th, 2013 at 2:21am

Bobbyd wrote on Aug 18^th, 2013 at 4:52pm:

I take the Verapamil 3X daily, any thoughts?

Do speak to your doctor and / or pharmacist first before changing when you take your verapamil. Explain that you'll be wanting to take a calcium supplement.

Normally verapamil is taken at multiple times during the day so that the level in the bloodstream remains more constant as for each dose you take, the active level drops by half over about 8 hours (it varies between people). If you take it all in the morning and you mainly get CHs in the early hours of the morning, probably less than half the verapamil will be effective.

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Bobbyd

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #6 - Aug 19^th, 2013 at 8:04am

Thanks for all of the info. I found a paper from Harvard Medical about calcium and the effectiveness of Verapamil. I went searching after two ferocious CH after drinking chocolate milk and it seemed more than coincidence, a K9 for 1.5 hours both times. Not sure if it was chocolate or the milk. But I had a similar situation after a lot of pizza, a K7 but only for 15 mins.

Could I skip the calcium or take much less? I am tempted to try milk solo but a little horrified of the maybe?

Again thanks a lot for the input and thoughts. I am in month 4 and getting hit it several times a day with high scale numbers every 3 or 4 days. I have horrified my wife, people at work, and worst of all my kids. At wits end. Embarrassed

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Batch

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #7 - Aug 19^th, 2013 at 3:37pm

Hey Bobbyd,

Have you seen your doctor for the 25(OH)D lab test? Without the results of this lab test... you're flying blind.

There are no real pitfalls to the anti-inflammatory regimen... It's also best to take the entire regimen with the largest meal of the day with the most fats. This can help vitamin D3 absorption by as much as 50%.

Vitamin D3 is also lipophilic... It loves lipid/fats... Accordingly taking it with the Omega-3 Fish Oil is also a good idea.

Regarding calcium and verapamil... I suspect from your posts you're taking verapamil for your cluster headaches... How well is the verapamil working?

You can skip the calcium for a few weeks or until you experience a pain free response... at that point you can talk with your doc about coming off the verapamil like many other CH'ers using this regimen have done. Just be sure to take the rest of the vitamin D3 cofactors.

The main reason I included calcium in the anti-inflammatory regimen list of supplements is due to the fact that vitamin D3 turbocharges calcium homeostasis... The process of maintaining total calcium serum concentration in a very narrow range.

Taking 10,000 IU/day vitamin D3 pulls available calcium from the gut into the blood stream at higher rates to maintain blood calcium levels in a very narrow range. Excess calcium is sent to the bones to build bone mineral density... or it's pumped over the side in urine...

Not so strangely, if there's insufficient calcium in the gut, vitamin D3 will pull the needed calcium from the bones to maintain serum calcium concentrations.

This process happens all the time and is a normal part of calcium homeostasis... It's also not a problem as long as there's sufficient dietary or supplemental calcium.

Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch

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Bobbyd

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #8 - Aug 19^th, 2013 at 5:26pm

Thanks for the info. Yes the verapamil is for cluster headaches and I would say that about 5 weeks in on verapamil I am about a 60-70% improvement. I will still some fairly big hits with a lot of shadows. Big hits are definitely down but getting 2-3 major a week.

I am excited about the improvement but what the verapamil is not taking care or stopping is still a major issue with life, work, home, etc .....

I am hoping the D3 will work as it has for so many of you. The Verapmil, even at only 120mg 3x daily is sucking the life out me, however as we can all agree, I would rather that than pounding my head on the kitchen floor and pacing the streets at 2AM.

Also, I have not had any tests done. I am still just hurting and am willing to try anything. I kinda figured that the D3 could not hurt to try?

Thanks Bobby

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Batch

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #9 - Aug 19^th, 2013 at 10:24pm

Bobbyd,

I lived on oxygen therapy for my first 5 years as a chronic CH'er... until the anti-inflammatory regimen with vitamin D3 came along...

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The O2PTIMASK™ kit with InGage™ 0-60 liter/minute regulator and the Carnét oxygen demand valve both worked equally well delivering oxygen at flow rates that support hyperventilation. My average abort times were around 5 minutes to a pain free state.

No verapamil, dopeycoat, or other prevents... Too many side effects. I found the calcium citrate with magnesium, zinc and boron along with the Omega-3 Fish Oil held the frequency down most of the time.

Take care

V/R, Batch

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You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there

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waymoz

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #10 - Aug 20^th, 2013 at 4:55am

Hey bobby! I would recommend the Vit D3 regime to start immediately. Obvious reason for me is you're comparing vitamin supplements to pharmaceutical drugs. While you are still getting much less attacks using verapamil, I and a lot of others have become pain free from the D3 regime.

It has about 80% success rate so I think it's worth a try over pharmaceutical medicines.

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Bobbyd

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Re: Question about D3
Reply #11 - Aug 20^th, 2013 at 5:22pm

Thanks for the replies. I was so against any meds due to the side effects. I was in such a tough place that I caved and had some success but still side effects and still not PF although much better. I waiting to hear about my blood work before I try the D3.

This is in 4 months and in the last 10 years I never went longer than 4 weeks or so 2X a year.

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