Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Clusterheadaches.com
 
Search box updated Dec 3, 2011... Search ch.com with Google!
  HomeHelpSearchLoginRegisterEvent CalendarBirthday List  
 





Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc (Read 2700 times)
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Jul 9th, 2020 at 4:05pm
 
Hi there,
† †† †† †† † some help with this cycle would be appreciated. I'm entering an acute phase right now. I've been on the D3 regimen for 3 yrs now. My headaches come on during high pollen season:allergic to grass. I'm currently doing an immunotherapy treatment to hopefully kill my allergies and in so doing end the headaches. Unfortunately the treatment itself is a trigger. So it started 3 months ago. The headaches have been ramping up since then. 2 years ago when I was in this situation Batch gave me some advice about upping my D3 to a loading dose for a week and adding 100 mg of benedryl for one week. It worked a charm and broke the cycle. Unfortunately this time it has not. I have been using 100mg of† Benedryl for 3 weeks now. It reduced the headaches but did not end them. Id I try to reduce the benedryl the headaches become much more acute. What to do? Should I increase Benedryl? Go off it for a while and try again?
† †† Also, last year I started using oxygen. It works! So much focus on D3 here that I hadn't realised how effective O2 is (I've been getting CH's for 20years). My neuro took some convincing but he finally filled out a script. I do a flow rate of either 15 or 25 L/Min and got† a mask from this site. The issue is that I am going through a lot of O2 having access only to E tanks so find myself limiting my intake....not good. Does anyone know a good source to buy an M tank regulator with a flow rate of at least 25 L/Min? Also you talk about direct flow being a great way to go but that the initial set up cost would be expensive. Is there a regulator out there for an M tank that would do both?
† †And another question.† When I use oxygen I stop at the 15 min time limit. Often the headache is gone but the shadow remains, if you know what I mean. I fall asleep and then WHAM and hour later a super fast VERY acute headache comes in like a runaway train that even Zomig doesn't seem to get under control. Is this common with oxygen to get a rebound headache. Do any of you have experience when NOT to use O2 and go directly to the Zomig so that maybe you prevent this from happening. Last night the rebound from 02 was so intense I came very close to blacking out, it was one of the worst I've ever had and there have been hundreds if not thousands (I dread to do a tally).
† I know that's a lot of info, any help on any issue I raised would be much appreciated.†
1. How to end this cycle ? Specifically how to deal with titrating the Benedryl.
2. M tank regulator with flow rate of at least 25 L/Min and attachment for both the regular mask and the direct flow system
3. Can O2 cause nasty rebound headaches. What am I doing wrong/ How to fix
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #1 - Jul 9th, 2020 at 4:40pm
 
It looks like I need a CGA 540 regulator for a type M tank. Who makes and/or distributes the best CGA 540 regulators ? Is a type M tank what's referred to as a welding tank?†

I am getting an on demand valve system with a DISS connection so I am looking for a regulator that connects to that and a Type M tank.   Would a welding regulator work?





Back to top
« Last Edit: Jul 9th, 2020 at 5:32pm by nichjfw »  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3685
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #2 - Jul 10th, 2020 at 12:52pm
 
Hey Nichjfw,

I know what you're going through.† After nearly 10 years taking the anti-inflammatory regimen with 10,000 IU/day vitamin D3 and all the cofactors, I've had burn through CH hits during heavy pollen and mold spore periods on two occasions.† During these periods, Benadryl (Diphenhydramine HCL) and oxygen were not as effective in controlling my CH.† †As the guy who developed this regimen, it was both embarrassing and frustrating to have this happen.† Fortunately, the solution was relatively simple.

I increased my vitamin D3 intake by loading at 50,000 IU/day for a week to 10 days in order to elevate my serum 25(OH)D3 concentration above 100 ng/mL.† I actually elevated my 25(OH)D3 to 180 ng/mL.† Lab tests of my serum 25(OH)D3, calcium and PTH indicated this was very safe as my serum calcium remained within its normal reference range.† When my CH were back under control I returned to a new vitamin D3 maintenance dose at 15,000 IU/day.

During the last outbreak in June of 2018, I also switched vitamin D3 brands from the oil-based liquid softgel formulation to the Bio-Tech D3-50 50,000 IU water soluble form of vitamin D3.† I found it to be faster acting with a higher bioequivalence in elevating serum 25(OH)D3 than the same dose of the liquid softgel formulations.† I also switched from the vitamin B 50/100 complex to Methyl Folate + vitamin B complex as it too has a higher bioequivalence.†

I have not had a CH outbreak since then. The higher bioequivalence of the Bio-Tech D3-50 is also proving more effective in preventing my CH. I've taken one 50,000 IU Bio-Tech D3-50 capsule a week since January of 2019 and this has kept me CH pain free with a 25(OH)D3 serum concentration around 150 ng/mL over three successive lab tests since then as illustrated in the 3-year chart of my labs for 25(OH)D3, calcium and PTH.†

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

The following photo illustrates these changes to the anti-inflammatory regimen supplements by brand and dose.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

There are additional supplements you can take to boost the CH preventative effect.† They include 1000 mg/day Turmeric (Curcumin), 3 grams/day liposomal vitamin C taken at 1 gram (1000 mg) three times a day, CoQ10, 400 to 800 mg/day Quercetin, 75 mg/day Resveratrol, 3 mg/day boron and a good Probiotic.† Not surprisingly, if you add 50 mg/day zinc to this list of supplements along with the basic regimen illustrated above, you have one of the best immune system boosting strategies to reduce the incidence of viral infections like the flu, colds and even coronavirus.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

If you're just interested in boosting your immune system functions to reduce the incidence of viral infections, the following photo illustrates the basic immune boosting supplements.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch
Back to top
  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #3 - Jul 10th, 2020 at 2:22pm
 
Thanks Batch for getting back to me, I very much appreciate any input. Sometimes it can get very painful and lonely. I have the Biotech and am going to try a loading dose. Thanks again, glad to here you've managed to stay pain free the last 2 years, I believe the last time we touched base was right after you had had that episode with the mold in the cabin while salmon fishing in Alaska.

Nick
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Kat92
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 6
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #4 - Jul 11th, 2020 at 12:19pm
 
Hey Batch! I was reading through your new regimen and see you added Methyl Folate with B12 Complex.  I just purchased that and some CoQ10.  I messaged you on cluster busters actually a few days ago.  I have been on the D3 regimen for a year now but my heavy headache season starts end of June beginning of July.  I am chronic CH with shadows all year and bad spells during the summer months.  Verapamil was a fail and I am determined to get the D3 regimen to work for me.  May I start the loading dose again for a week with added benadryl if I have already been on the regimen for one year?  I had been doing the weekly Bio-tech D3 50 as instructed the entire year.  Is it safe for me to do the loading dose?  I have not had my vitamin levels checked in almost a year, but I recall my vitamin D being fairly low. Thanks for letting me chime in on the thread!

Kat

Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
earthbee
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 35
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #5 - Jul 12th, 2020 at 2:39pm
 
Try melatonin and Psychedelics
Vitamin K is good to take with Vitamin D.
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register is a good company for that.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

This western medicine man did a Ayahuasca session ,ROCK AND ROLL 7 MONTHS PEACE OF GOD DAM PAIN
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register


Francis Rico Writerspeak:
(LINK):Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Back to top
« Last Edit: Sep 4th, 2020 at 11:44am by earthbee »  
 
IP Logged
 
earthbee
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 35
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #6 - Jul 17th, 2020 at 10:18am
 
Try Benylin dry cough blue
Contains DXM which is ad mild like ketamine or pcp

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #7 - Jul 23rd, 2020 at 3:47pm
 
So an update 12 days later. THANKS for the advice Batch, much appreciated. I have been taking the loading dose of 50000 IU D3 and am now stopping as it has been over days. The headaches are not gone but they a MUCH less accute and there were 3 pain free nights, which is more than there had been in the past 2 months. I really want to put this beast to rest but it seems to be right on the edge. I found that upping my magnesium intake from 400mg to 800mg had a huge effect as well. Would you recommend maintaining a elevated D3 regimen of 50 000 IU every 3 days at this point? Again, thanks for the help,

Nick
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2020 at 3:47pm by nichjfw »  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3685
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #8 - Jul 26th, 2020 at 6:15pm
 
Nick, Kat,

As it appears you're both in the same boat with klingon CH still hitting, but at longer intervals and less intense pain, the same answers may apply.

First, it's always wise to see your PCP/GP for lab tests of your serum 25(OH)D3, calcium and PTH.† On one hand, without the results of these labs in hand, you're shooting in the dark on whether or not to take additional loading doses of vitamin D3.† On the other hand, if you're still experiencing CH, the most common cause is your serum 25(OH)D3 is still too low.†

On that point you need to understand that the mechanism of action by which vitamin D3 and its cofactors help prevent CH involves genetic expression that takes place at the cellular level in the DNA contained in the trigeminal ganglia neuronal nucleus.† Accordingly, the serum level concentration of 25(OH)D3 is just a biomarker.†

That said, the law of molecular diffusion across a semipermeable cellular membrane and into the cell cytoplasm would dictate the cellular concentration would be at least as high as the serum concentration and likely higher.† Accordingly, it's best to think of the 25(OH)D3 serum concentration as the reservoir and as long as the serum concentration in that reservoir is high enough, there should be sufficient cellular concentration of vitamin D3 and 25(OH)D3 to enable the needed genetic expression.†

Bottom line, many CHers on the verge of going completely CH pain free have found an additional 3 to 5 days of 50,000 IU/day vitamin D3 loading doses does the trick. Then drop back to an initial vitamin D3 maintenance of 50,000 IU/week with the Bio-Tech D3-50.† If the CH return at that maintenance dose, load for another couple days then increase the maintenance dose to one (1) Bio-Tech D3-50 every 5 days.† A few CHers have needed to dose with the Bio-Tech D3-50 at one every 3 days during the high pollen or mold spore seasons.

Doubling the magnesium dose to 800 mg/day (400 mg in the am and 400 mg in the pm) while loading† vitamin D3 is very important as the enzymatic processes that hydroxylate vitamin D3 to 25(OH)D3 and 25(OH)D3 to 1,25(OH)2D3 consume magnesium. Without the additional magnesium you can end up with a calcium-magnesium imbalance caused by too little magnesium.† Muscle cramps are a classic indication of insufficient magnesium.

In a preliminary analysis, a GrassrootsHealth Nutrient Research Institute study found that individuals who do not take supplemental magnesium need, on average, 146% more vitamin D to achieve a blood level of 40 ng/ml (100 nmol/L), compared to those who take at least 400 mg of magnesium per day.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

In some cases, doubling the Omega-3 fish oil has helped achieve a CH pain free response. The switch to Methyl Folate+ vitamin B complex is also a good move.† Since switching to Methyl Folate + in Jan of 2019, I've not had any CH burn through hits due to allergic reactions and the pollen has been fearsome around here.

Regarding the Benadryl (Diphenhydramine HCL) if there's no response with a marked decrease in the frequency of CH after 5 days, I would discontinue.

Hope this helps.† Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch


Back to top
  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #9 - Jul 28th, 2020 at 10:46pm
 
Thanks for the response Batch,
                                              I'm going to try to get my levels checked though it's tricky here in Canada right now what with Covid shutting a lot of things down. Thanks for the advice, I feel like I am really close right now, just need to ccompletely close the headache drawer,

Nick
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3685
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #10 - Jul 28th, 2020 at 11:21pm
 
Hey Nick,

Your National Health System in Canada and in the individual Provinces try to make lab tests of 25(OH)D as difficult as possible to avoid their costs.† The best way around this is to tell your PCP you're taking 50,000 IU/day vitamin D3 loading doses (a.k.a., hypervitaminosis D) and want to make sure your 25(OH)D3 is not too high or that you re not hypercalcemic.† Telling your PCP this usually works like a charm as the 25(OH)D lab test is covered if there's a possibility of hypercalcemia.

Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch
Back to top
  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #11 - Aug 13th, 2020 at 9:40pm
 
Hi Batch
† †† †† †† †† †thanks for the advice, I'm going to get my levels checked in the next couple of weeks as I do wonder about my calcium levels. Now for the good news, I don't want to jinx myself but I've been 10 days headache free at this point! What seemed to help kick the cycle completely was a canoe trip of all things. 8 days in Temagami, travelling over 100 km through northern ontario widerness. I had just finished 10 days† of a loading dose so it was very good timing to get out of dodge and decompress. Stress is a huge trigger with these things for me. Thanks very much for all the advice over the past few weeks, very much appreciated. I'll let you know where my levels are at once I have the data.

ps tapered off the benedryl too while on the canoe trip, went very smoothly.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Aug 13th, 2020 at 9:50pm by nichjfw »  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3685
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #12 - Aug 14th, 2020 at 5:27pm
 
Nick,

"10 days headache free" Woo Hoo!!!† I love it when that happens.

Take care and please keep us posted when your lab results come back.

V/R, Batch
Back to top
« Last Edit: Aug 14th, 2020 at 5:27pm by Batch »  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
LaurenZ
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 3
Corrales, New Mexico
Gender: female
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #13 - Aug 24th, 2020 at 6:12pm
 
Hi - wow this thread has been really interesting to read- I feel so relieved and I cant believe i didnt get on this site sooner - I always get my headaches in the spring and have wondered about allergies / inflammation and how it could all be linked - Does anyone find relief in taking something like claritin every day too? Im going to start benadryl tonight (my allergies are always pretty bad here in NM and are crazy right now bc fires in colorado sending tons of smoke down here) and also am going to start daily claritin - I also take montelukast to help control asthma stuff that flares up with allergy season....Thanks for thoughts on this <3 <3
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #14 - Aug 6th, 2021 at 9:27am
 
Bit of a Bump
† †† †† †† †† †† †† † Hi again. The headaches have been kept at bay for almost a year now, but after a pretty severe trigger about a month ago they are rolling in fiercely over the last few days. I did a loading dose without the Benedryl for 19 days starting about 4 weeks ago. It worked really well while it lasted, but the moment, the very night, I dropped back down to 10000 IU the headaches were back. Yesterday there were four starting in the afternoon and lasting until after midnight. I am currently taking 800 mg Magnesium and 240 mcg Vitamen K, as well as fish oil and tumeric. I don't know what to do at this point as my D3 levels must be through the roof, though I haven't done any testing to see about D3/Calcium levels as my doc is out of town. How long do you think I would have to wait before trying another loading dose? I've currently started Benedryl 25 mg twice a day, but I feel like I missed the boat as I should have started it when I started the loading dose. Hindsight is 20/20....
Back to top
« Last Edit: Aug 6th, 2021 at 9:37am by nichjfw »  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3685
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #15 - Aug 7th, 2021 at 1:58pm
 
Hey Nick,

Good question on frequency of loading dose.† For starters, feedback from CHers over the last four months indicate a combination of 100,000 IU of vitamin D3 (2 capsules of the Bio-Tech D3-50) and 0.5 mL of Micro D3 (40,000 IU) taken sublingual is an effective daily loading dose that elevates serum 25(OH)D3 rapidly in 4 to 5 days for a CH pain free response.† A few CHers have reported staying at this loading dose for longer periods to experience a CH pain free rresponse before starting a taper.† No reports of hypercalcemia so no vitamin D3 intoxication/toxicity.† Of course it's prudent to see your PCP/GP for labs of your serum 25(OH)D3, calcium and PTH once you've been CH pain free for a few days and no longer than 30 days after starting this loading schedule.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

I've been taking this same loading dose combination three to four times a week since late March to combat the histamine released by allergic reactions to Alder and Big Leaf Maple pollen.† No adverse side effects and my lab results for 25 May, tell the story.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

My PCP had no problem with my 25(OH)D3 up at 277 ng/mL as my serum calcium remained within its normal reference range.† All the other labs for my annual physical were in the green as well.

There's a fascinating related study on the use on vitamin D3 nanoemulsion treating patients with COVID-19 titled† Impact of daily high dose oral vitamin D therapy on the inflammatory markers in patients with COVID 19 disease that can be downloaded at the following link.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

During this study, COVID-19 patients were given 60,000 IU/day of a vitamin D3 nanoemulsion for a week.† This resulted in a significant decrease in laboratory measured inflammatory markers without any side effects.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

There are five COVID-19 studies using vitamin D3 total loading doses between 420,000 IU and 1.2 million IU during the first week of treatment without adverse side effects.†

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch
Back to top
« Last Edit: Aug 7th, 2021 at 3:10pm by Batch »  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
nichjfw
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 18
Ottawa Canuckland
Gender: male
Re: Please advice needed wrt D3, Oxygen, Benedryl, etc
Reply #16 - Aug 8th, 2021 at 5:42pm
 
Thanks very much for the reply Batch,
† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† †† so if I understand correctly you have been taking 140,000 IU of D3 three to four times a week for 5 months now. That is much more than I have been taking and puts my mind at ease. It is hard when there is no ready reference point available. That said I saw my GP today and she is going to send me a requisition order for bloodwork. I'll let you know where my levels are at.†
Back to top
« Last Edit: Aug 8th, 2021 at 5:49pm by nichjfw »  
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print

DISCLAIMER: All information contained on this web site is for informational purposes only.  It is in no way intended to be used as a replacement for professional medical treatment.   clusterheadaches.com makes no claims as to the scientific/clinical validity of the information on this site OR to that of the information linked to from this site.  All information taken from the internet should be discussed with a medical professional!