Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Clusterheadaches.com
 
Search box updated Dec 3, 2011... Search ch.com with Google!
  HomeHelpSearchLoginRegisterEvent CalendarBirthday List  
 





Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
Chronic "Cycles" (Read 3754 times)
zacsz
Ex Member



Chronic "Cycles"
Nov 26th, 2011 at 7:19pm
 
Hey, all... I've been having a really rough time the last 2-3 weeks; 4-5 attacks a day, most lasting over 2 hours. I'm chronic and it's not usually like this, but every once in a while I'll get hit this often. When it's not this bad, I get 1-2 a day and sometimes escape a full 24 hours without one. I was just wondering if any other chronic sufferers find this; that sometimes they'll have short (or maybe long?) bouts that are worse than their normal routine. Or, if you're not chronic, do you know if this is unusual?
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #1 - Nov 26th, 2011 at 8:40pm
 
Thank you, sounds about right. This is an unfortunately high and unfortunately long one, for me.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Callico
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


Author of "Stranded at
Romson's Lodge


Posts: 4916
Aurora IL
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #2 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 2:23am
 
Yup.  Up and down somewhat like a waves hitting a beach, with once in a while a larger than normal wave hitting.  As the waves change with the wind and weather so the cycles change with CH.  Sometimes slowly and with longer periods of either high or low, or as they have been for me the last several months they seem to change weekly.


Jerry
Back to top
  

"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of dung by the clean end." Texas A&M Student (unknown)
Jerry Callison  
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #3 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 12:27pm
 
Thanks, Jerry. I've just had to learn slowly because while I've been dealing with the beast for coming on two years, my headaches really didn't seem to fit clusters at first. I mean, they shared some of the trademark characteristics but were also missing a lot... I believe my diagnosis was "atypical cluster headaches" (a lot of good that does me). Over the past 6 months or so, my headaches changed slightly. They are now in a much more typical chronic cluster pattern, but I'm still learning to live with the slight differences in my HAs now. I'm seeing Doc on Tuesday and we need to get a little more aggressive to deal with the current high cycle, but hopefully we'll get on top of it...
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 12:29pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Kevin_M
CH.com Sponsor
***
Offline


withered branches grow
green again.


Posts: 8754
Michigan, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #4 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 12:52pm
 
Quote:
I've been dealing with the beast for coming on two years, my headaches really didn't seem to fit clusters at first. I mean, they shared some of the trademark characteristics but were also missing a lot... I believe my diagnosis was "atypical cluster headaches" (a lot of good that does me). Over the past 6 months or so, my headaches changed slightly. They are now in a much more typical chronic cluster pattern,

I'm still learning to live with the slight differences in my HAs now.


My first cycle I seemed able to bear with what was then terrible pain, but nothing like what followed in episodes following.  And the first couple of cycles were managed without preventatives.

Thereafter, as CH showed its full face and got more aggressive, I found old ways did not work.  Without option, I had to also had to get more aggressive with treatment.  Gradually they became chronic with high periods and low, fluctuating times of higher preventive doses and more oxygen use with lulls of no abortives needed and lowered preventive measures.


Quote:
I'm seeing Doc on Tuesday and we need to get a little more aggressive to deal with the current high cycle, but hopefully we'll get on top of it...


If your CH treatment needs updating or improving after two years to help shadow its immense potential to wallop through a former set regimen, I found that to be true, too.   
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:04pm by Kevin_M »  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #5 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:07pm
 
I actually had (what I thought to be) a rather brilliant idea yesterday that I need to bring up with Doc tomorrow. I have found a number of medications that DO help for the most part, but usually their effectiveness wanes after a few months. (For example, had great success with Verap from August-Oct. this year, and then this current high cycle started even though I'm still on 800mg). Maybe I need to be on some sort of rotating preventative schedule, as well as my abortives.... I'm also working on the O2. It's never worked for me in the past even though I've followed all the tips on the O2 info page here and always used very high flow rates (>25LPM) but there's no reason not to give it at least one more go... I just feel a bit at a stalemate for the time being.

I should also clarify it seems that I cycle through high and low fairly quickly and briefly, most times. This time is longer than usual. When the Verap was most effective, I was making it 3-4 days in a row without headaches, and sometimes would get 1 or 2 in a day. Then there would be 3-day stretches where I'd have 4-5 a day, but much less intense than right now (probably thanks to the Verap), and then after a few days I'd be back down to none or one. They're really all over the place, which makes it so difficult...
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:12pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Kevin_M
CH.com Sponsor
***
Offline


withered branches grow
green again.


Posts: 8754
Michigan, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #6 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:30pm
 

Quote:
it seems that I cycle through high and low fairly quickly and briefly, most times. This time is longer than usual.


In the past, I've needed the 900+ level with verap, but not for long. 

Can the drinks with caffeine and tourine(sp) assist during the day to suppress at this time?

Icepacks are a recourse with brutal ones.

Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:35pm by Kevin_M »  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #7 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:49pm
 
The amount of caffeine/taurine it would take to help knock an attack down even two notches on the kip makes me feel so sick and wired it's almost not worth it. I've tried slamming a single red bull for the caff/taurine in conjunction with a bunch of coffee I used to keep in the fridge specifically for these occasions (just to give it a go), but I have mostly cut caffeine out of my daily diet other than some tea or a soda with dinner, so it really overwhelms me and just makes me feel worse. I continue to experiment with caffeine and energy drinks but it's a bit of lose-lose as they don't seem to help much and then just make me feel crazed and even more frazzled when the caffeine kicks in. The most I can seem to handle without feeling weird is a 20 oz. bottle of dark cola, which occasionally (but not always) helps take the sharpest edge off.

I am in a particularly unfortunate spot right now because my headaches do last on the longer side of CHs when they're in full force... usually over 2 hours, almost never more than 3.5. But they definitely can go on that long and frequently do. I can't remember the last time I had a <hr long attack, other than the times I was able to tackle it quick with zomig or trex before it got too out of hand.

My BP is starting to get into the realm that my Doc doesn't want to increase the Verap much more, and I don't think either of us are certain that going up another 160mg will make a phenomenal difference at the moment considering I'm already on a pretty high dose. I'm also taking 300mg of Neurontin a day on top of the Verap, which he put me on as soon as I called and said SOS. No change, though.

Icepacks and air conditioners are my best friends... I always feel a little better during an attack if I'm in an ice-cold environment with a pack on my face; the beast really overheats me. I've never noticed a real decrease in pain from an icepack, but they are at least somewhat soothing to me and I try to stick one on my head for every attack if there's ice available.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 1:56pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Kevin_M
CH.com Sponsor
***
Offline


withered branches grow
green again.


Posts: 8754
Michigan, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #8 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 2:22pm
 
It seems you are in good hands.  CH can be an unruly monster. 


Quote:
my headaches do last on the longer side of CHs when they're in full force... usually over 2 hours, almost never more than 3.5. But they definitely can go on that long and frequently do.


Being prey to this, I am truly hoping giving oxygen another go will come through for you better. 



Quote:
I've never noticed a real decrease in pain from an icepack, but they are at least somewhat soothing to me


It gives me the confirmation I'm doing what I can to just dissipate heat, dull a bit of pain, or even only doing something as an accompaniment for enduring.  Beats not having it at those times.  Melting them through, I keep a few in the freezer, fresh and cold as can be.   Smiley
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #9 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 3:38pm
 
Thanks very much for all the support; I do feel as though I am in very good hands... but even the best hands sometimes get flustered in the face of treatment resistant chronic clusters. Doc has been wonderful, though, so hopefully I'll come out of this appointment at least feeling a little emotionally better. We all know what it's like fearing day in and day out how many attacks today, how bad, etc... it's really wreaking havoc on my mental health. But I'll be fine. Just need a thorough Doctor's appointment, which I have coming up quite soon.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Kevin_M
CH.com Sponsor
***
Offline


withered branches grow
green again.


Posts: 8754
Michigan, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #10 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 3:56pm
 
Quote:
but even the best hands sometimes get flustered in the face of treatment resistant chronic clusters.


This sometimes spurs one beyond curiosity through the doors of the very successful clusterbusters.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 27th, 2011 at 3:57pm by Kevin_M »  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #11 - Nov 27th, 2011 at 6:49pm
 
Clusterbusting seems like a no-go for me... while I am 99% better now, I have a history of serious psychiatric problems so it doesn't look like it's a viable option Sad
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
wimsey1
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 2457
MA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #12 - Nov 28th, 2011 at 8:11am
 
Zac, like you, I am chronic with cycles. Jerry's description of CHs compared to waves on the beach is a perfect one. And, like you, I have from time to time considered the lithium/verapamil cocktail. Right now, at 640mg/day, I get hit 3-5 times a day, but they are all manageable with Monster and O2 at the same time. I've never had any success with an energy drink alone, only when coupled with O2. And to be honest, I do have the best results when I fully comply with Batch's O2 technique of emptying the lungs of as much CO2 as possible first. It is hard work but it does stop a hit dead in its tracks. I've learned to accept that my hits are the inbetweens, and live my life in the non-hit times. that takes careful scheduling though. Good luck with this, and know you are in my prayers. Blessings. lance
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Kevin_M
CH.com Sponsor
***
Offline


withered branches grow
green again.


Posts: 8754
Michigan, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #13 - Nov 28th, 2011 at 1:12pm
 
If taking other medications, check interactions, even ones that may block effectiveness of a preventative.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
zacsz
Ex Member



Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #14 - Nov 28th, 2011 at 7:06pm
 
Thanks Kevin, I will, but I'm hardly on any other meds than for my headaches anymore... almost off my daily mood-stabilizer (been titrating down for the last year) and all I take for pysch stuff is Xanax as needed for occasional panic attacks, so I don't think that would interfere. I do take sleep medication as I have severe insomnia so I'll do some poking around on that front, too.

I have a doctor's appointment tomorrow so I'll let you know how that goes. We need to rethink my preventative since the Verap isn't cutting it. Lance, unfortunately, I don't think I could add Lithium as I reacted extremely poorly when I was put on it for my Bipolar, originally. It might be worth another shot but it made me crazy and violently ill. It's problematic, for sure, but some of my medical history prevents me from using some of the stuff that might really help (Lithium, clusterbusting).

I'll keep you posted. The primary goals tomorrow are to figure out a new preventative plan, revamp my O2 set-up/prescription, and figure out a way to give me a few pain free days this week because I feel as though I am going absolutely mad from the amount of time per day I spend in pain.

Thanks for all the support.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Nov 28th, 2011 at 7:07pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Matt Miller
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


This too shall pass...


Posts: 36
NW Arkansas
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #15 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 11:10am
 
Zac,
  I know this is a few months old, but i just wanted to chime in. I too am a Chronic CHer, and I also have cycles of high and low CHs

I am in the same boat as you in that my prevents didn't work, the side effects were horrible for me (especially Lithium. I swear it made me an emotional wreck...my wife said [afterwards, not during or it would have hurt me too bad] that it was like being married to another woman. I would cry at the drop of a hat, and i'm not a crying man)

When i am in a High Cycle (3+ hits daytime and 2-3 each night) i do what i can do abort, but my neuro and I are having a hard time finding anything that works. I've noticed, with the help of my headache diary, that (like many of us) the Winter solstice tends to ramp up a HIGH cycle. I get BAD night ones during winter months, and tend to get bad day ones during summer months, with low periods in spring and fall (as long as my allergies are under control).

While i don't have a lot of advice for you on this, i can 100% understand what you are going through. If you aren't keeping a headache journal, i would advise you to start, as they are amazing in their ability to help you plan your life around these demons. Even though we are Chronic, we have periods of bad and periods of good. It helps to know in advance what you will be up against!!
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Cailin
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 19
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #16 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 4:19pm
 
I'm chronic too and the winter is definitely worse for attacks. At this time I'm on deseril/ sansert but that is causing terrible problems and I have to stop it today. back to the Topamax for a while until neuro can fit me in to botox clinic. Am going to give the anti- inflammatory regime a go while I'm waiting, that and the O2 I hope get me over the next week or so. Chronic makes you miserable because the best you can hope for is just a couple of them a day and the worst is 24 hours of misery and hell.

Hope this vitamin thing works!

keep the faith Smiley
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Matt Miller
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


This too shall pass...


Posts: 36
NW Arkansas
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #17 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 4:49pm
 
Callin,
i've heard of the botox route but never wanted to try it. Have you done it in the past? how does it work for you?

Chronic is a life stealer sometimes with those 5-6 hits a day and 4 more at night for good measure. I've had adverse reactions to every med i've been tried on. Busting hasn't helped. but, as with everything else, make due with the PF times inbetween.

Like one of the other Chronics on here said, life is time between hits, not the hits (horrible paraphrase i'm sure) but i've kept that bit of advice to heart, and add it to my Demon Dance mantra of "this too shall pass".
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Cailin
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 19
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #18 - Jan 21st, 2012 at 12:59pm
 
Hi

this will me my first run at botox and I'm not too keen to try it but I'm so miserable at this stage I'd nearly do it myself. Only a day off the last lot of medication and I'm sucking oxygen in and shoving needles into me again. I thought I was going nuts as I never got a break from these headaches I always thought clusters were episodic but this site has been an education for me!

I'll let you know how the poison goes
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Matt Miller
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


This too shall pass...


Posts: 36
NW Arkansas
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #19 - Jan 24th, 2012 at 10:08am
 
Quote:
I'll let you know how the poison goes


Yes please do. Good luck, PDFAN
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Evan O
CH.com Junior
**
Offline




Posts: 27
Brooklyn, New York
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #20 - May 18th, 2012 at 2:17am
 
For me (chronic too), I think my "highs" are when I am experiencing an additional 1-3 rebound HAs.

The only thing that I could associate with the highs is when I am using the imitrex injection for EVERY attack, without using any other abortive in a days period. My highs are generally 3-5 a day at 2.5hrs without injection. Energy drinks/coffee have helped reduce pain on the kip but that all depends on how quickly I get my hands on it.

I have had week long "highs" and a night without sleep resulted in a low for a few days. Don't know if it was a coincidence, but i wouldnt recommend trying. Forcing myself to stay awake was probably my dumbest experiment yet.  What I would do for a few zzz's.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
MPMIII
CH.com Veteran
***
Offline




Posts: 112
Alabama
Gender: male
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #21 - May 18th, 2012 at 8:49am
 
I am chronic as well and I have roughly 3-4 high cycles per year. They generally last 1-2 weeks.  I am in one of those cycles right now and understand your pain.  Not sure what triggers these cycles.  My wife seems to think they come with a change in seasons or the pollen in the air.  Just when I think I have some normalcy and control over the beast with one or two hits a day, I get hit with these high cycles.  Hang in there and wait for the lull. 

   
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Sunday77
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


On n'a qu'une Vie ŕ vivre!


Posts: 1
Gatineau, Qc
Gender: female
Re: Chronic "Cycles"
Reply #22 - May 23rd, 2012 at 1:08am
 
Good Day,
I am chronic too, but it seems to be in a different way: I get hit once, every 2 weeks, but the hit lasts between 48 to 72 hours.
I  am suffering CH since 20 years...  I discovered Imitrex injections a year ago, which relieve me for about 3-4 hours. Those injections has improved my quality of life a lot.
The longest I have been without an hit last year was 3 weeks.  It was awesome!
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print

DISCLAIMER: All information contained on this web site is for informational purposes only.  It is in no way intended to be used as a replacement for professional medical treatment.   clusterheadaches.com makes no claims as to the scientific/clinical validity of the information on this site OR to that of the information linked to from this site.  All information taken from the internet should be discussed with a medical professional!