Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Clusterheadaches.com
 
Search box updated Dec 3, 2011... Search ch.com with Google!
  HomeHelpSearchLoginRegisterEvent CalendarBirthday List  
 





Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print
Keto diet and cluster headaches (Read 4792 times)
RightSider
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 21
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #25 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:03pm
 
NicolŠs wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 10:30pm:
Hi all!

I've waited for a few weeks to write this post so as to be sure about all of this. RightSider: thank you very much for your insights!!

Summary:


I went through a cycle that lasted about 8 weeks. The very night I started a very low CH diet (no more than 20 grams of Carbs per day), the attacks went from 3-4 per night to 2 attacks easily abortable with no more than 2 minutes O2.

After seven days from starting on low CH diet, I had to take Prednisone to abort the cycle (I had to travel by plane and spend one night in another city because of work reasons).

But after the pred taper went off, I had no CH back. And since then, no more CH.

Long story:


I began a new cycle in August 20. The attacks were consistent every night from August 27 to October 03, with only 3 PFN plus two periods PFN due to Prednisone (lasting 5 and 10 days each one).

All these years since 2012, I've been on Batch's formula of D3 and its cofactors.

The attacks hit almost always every hour after sleeping, usually no more than 4 attacks per night (average 3 to 4 attacks).

Important fact: in this cycle something unusual happened: I had 3 attacks in the day (two of them at work). This is something that has happened very few times before (I'm clusterer since at least 2005). After reading this post, I realized something very interesting: during the hours just before those 3 day-attacks I ate big amounts of carbs:

  • One time two dishes of rice with roasted meat.
  • One time a big waffle that was made with lots of sugar.
  • A third time that I don't remember today exactly which carb I ate, in big quantity.


So, I saw clearly that the best option I had was to get into this train, do the very low carb diet and see what should happen.

The results, as I told you, have been very promising.

It is a pity that I had to take prednisone in order to fly and spend one night in another city. One could say that I's harder to know precisely the day when the cycle ended. All I know is that when I'm in cycle, I have some sort of a slight Neuralgia in the scalp (at every moment), in the same half where I'm getting hit. Well, after fourteen days on diet (and seven on Prednisone), I stopped feeling that Neuralgia. So I think that around that day (October 10th) the cycle actually ended.

Conclusions:


  • I think the very low carb diet actually helped me to soften the cycle and eventually stop it.
  • Being on this diet has been extremely easy for me:
    • No problem to stop eating carbs (even though I'm a big fan of potatoes and bread).
    • Only a light Keto Flu that hit around two weeks after beginning the diet. Muscular pain, sometimes a pain just below the kidneys, and the typical symptoms of a flu, minus the "respiratory ones".
    • I lost only 5 Kg (11 pounds). I'm now at 79 Kg (174 pounds) and I'm 1.89 meters (6 feet 2 inches) tall.
  • I also visited a Nutritionist, that had no problems with me being in this diet. Glucose normal, Ketone bodies in expectable levels, HDL and LDL Cholesterol in normal levels.
  • I'm not quite sure if what I've done is a Keto diet, Atkins diet or just a very low carbs diet, but anyway, limiting carbs to no more than 20 grams per day and increasing good fats and proteins is all what I did.


I'm eager to tell you any detail should you need or want to know more about them.

Best regards to each and everyone of you!



Hi NicolŠs

Thatís great to hear and another #lchf (or should I say #keto) diet success against the beast! Really happy for you. I still feel bullet proof and 20 years younger. No verapamil, no oxygen and no Imigran, its like 24/25 years of headaches never happened!

If you continue to lose weight and become lean, you may find out that your LDL cholesterol (which isn't actually cholesterol) starts to go up. Don't worry if it does. Very lean people (especially those who exercise a lot) will often start to produce more vLDL (which becomes LDL) due to the fact that they are burn more body fat for energy. The vLDL/LDL is the transport mechanism for your fat tissue to be taken to your cells for energy. The increased LDL is not dumping cholesterol on your artery walls! Given that you mentioned blood values, I thought you may like to know that.


Take good care of yourself and Ďwatch out for those carbsí!† Grin

Regards

RightSider
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
joyisnow77
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 1
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #26 - Mar 3rd, 2019 at 11:47am
 
Extremely interesting Rightsider! Many thanks for your kind follow-ups and thorough explanations† Cool Most importantly, congrats on the new PF life  Smiley

I might add that, as many of us are smokers, glutathion levels shows to be significantly lower in smokers. Glutathione is linked to serotonine levels as well in complex ways .

I will add NAC to my D3 regimen, add the broccoli sprouts and start the ketogenesis diet Smiley

Do you use an NAC supplements? What kind, posology and doseage would you recommend ?
Back to top
« Last Edit: Mar 4th, 2019 at 10:37am by joyisnow77 »  
 
IP Logged
 
RightSider
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 21
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #27 - Mar 4th, 2019 at 4:07pm
 

Hi Joyisnow77

Before I get onto your post, Iíd just like to say (with a big smile on my face) that today is now exactly fourth months medication and abortive free (I was on meds for around 22/23 years up until November). No attacks or shadows at all during this time and without checking my notes, Iíd say Iíve been headache free since August (I weaned myself of the meds VERY SLOWLY). Still feel fantastic on the diet and I now live a perfectly normal life, with none of the restrictions I put in place to minimise and deal with my attacks. Itís like 25 years of clusters never happened!

Thanks for your kind words and other comments. Itís interesting what you say about smokers and glutathione. However, I strongly believe the link between smoking and clusters is only an Ďassociationí. Smoking relieves stress and people with clusters get very stressed! The daily stress and physiological changes in the brain caused by daily attacks, means that clusterheadache sufferers get an extra Ďkickí from nicotine and find it very hard, if almost impossible to withdraw from it. I could be wrong, but thatís my simplified but honest opinion! Now, as for the NAC, I just buy the cheapest brand with decent reviews on Amazon whenever Iím running out. However, In the interests of complete transparency I must update you.† For the past month I have stopped taking the NAC, broccoli sprouts, D3, magnesium and all other supplements to see what would happen. Well, nothing did happen. Iíve remained headache free. That said, Iíll be going back on them next week for their general health benefits.

In addition to my research on glutathione, I have also been looking at something called NAD+. Itís a massively important chemical/molecule involved with energy metabolism and you produce more when in ketosis. Iím not going to go into detail now, because Iím still looking into it and it would need an even longer post! However, what I can say is that it could be a smoking gun. Basically, a very simplified version of my thoughts/research/opinion is as follows . . . . .

Ketogenic diet = upregulation of NAD+
More NAD+ = less neurogenic inflammation in the brain
Less neurogenic inflammation = less chance of trigeminal nerve activation
End result = far less chance of an attack

I would still throw glutathione into the mix as well because . . . .

More glutathione = less neurogenic inflammation, so etc, etc

It is worth stressing at this point that I do not think that a keto/lchf diet is a cure for cluster headaches. I donít think a high carb causes them either. We can never be cured of this condition because itís in our DNA. I am still a chronic cluster headache sufferer. However, by going ketogenic, my energy metabolism has changed. In simplified terms, this change in metabolism means that I am far less likely to trigger, or assist, the chain of events that leads to my trigeminal nerve being activated in a way that leads to an attack. Or, putting it another way - my brain chemistry is still super sensitive to the same things, but being in ketosis means the resulting chain of events doesnít quite reach the attack/pain stage! My trigeminal nerve stays super chilled.

The interesting thing you may wish to look at the moment is exogenous ketones. Basically, you can raise the levels of ketones in your blood without the LCHF diet or fasting (even though itís healthy, I recommend CH folk do not fast!!!). You do this by consuming them. To cut a long story short, there is currently a clinical trial taking place using Ďketone estersí in chronic migraine patients. The theory goes that raised levels of ketones may be all that is needed to stop migraines, rather than actually being in a ketogenic state. Ketone esters are like rocket fuel to ketone levels, but they cost an absolute fortune. However, you can buy something called BHB. This is the ketone that your body makes from the fat you eat. You can buy it as a kind of keto energy drink or keto meal replacement, though it is not as powerful as ketone esters. Iíve often wondered if it may be worth trying for cluster headaches. To be honest, BHB is still quite expensive and I have no idea if simply forcing ketone levels up in the blood would work in the same way as being in a ketogenic state. Given that I enjoy the LCHF diet and the amazing impact itís had on my health (in general), Iíve not felt it necessary to look for a substitution. So, Iíve not looked into the science behind the idea.

Anyhow, back to your situation. If you want to go into full battle against the beast armed to the teeth then I would go with what you have said. Full keto diet, D3 regime, NAC (600mg p/day), broccoli sprouts and Iím assuming you will be taking magnesium as part of the D3. Do not fast or even skip breakfast. Intermittent fasting (skipping breakfast consistently) caused high intensity and very frequent nocturnal attacks for me. Are all those steps necessary? Perhaps not. I believe that some sufferers may simply benefit from only going low carb (or even just zero sugar), some may need full keto, some may need full keto and the D3 regime (or just the D3 regime).† However, for some, it may need all of those steps.

My current (simplified) line of thinking is that us clusterheads have a basic genetic flaw. This flaw means we are susceptible to a form of neurogenic inflammation that leads to our trigeminal nerve activating in a very shitty way. For some people, simply restoring vitamin D3 levels may be enough to prevent the activation trigger point. For others it may need prolonged ketosis, and for others both. There will be other things that can affect this trigger point. Lack of magnesium, light levels, environmental toxins, sunlight exposure, sleep quality, the list goes on and on and on. However, I firmly believe that diet (not excluding background insulin resistance) has the biggest underlying impact on neurogenic inflammation BY FAR. The science supports this, and it makes complete sense to be fair. You really are what you eat!

Iíve waffled on enough! I hope you found some of that helpful and good look with the upcoming battle!

Regards

Rightsider
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
CHDAN
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 3
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #28 - Apr 8th, 2019 at 8:41pm
 
I to have been having remarkable success like rightsider. Being in Cluster Headache Hell everyday for a few years and having everything fail. About 3 months ago I stumbled across the Keto chronic Cluster Headache trial and also this post. I decided that I have to give this a good crack so I started Jan 5th. I didnt notice any benefits fo rabout 4 or 5 weeks then I had about a 50% reduction for a few weeks and then I started only waking up with shadows then one day out I had no pain no shadows no nothing! that turned into 2 days the 3 ect ect. Havent had to abort a headache for well over a month now.  I get a shadow about once a week to a fortnight, they are so weak it doesn't concern me.

For the first time in years I feel like a normal person who can smile again! after 3 months I feel like the benefits keep increasing as Im feeling better and better as each week passes. Lost about 10kgs too.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Mike NZ
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


Oxygen rocks! D3 too!


Posts: 3777
Auckland, New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #29 - Apr 9th, 2019 at 1:00am
 
Absolutely wonderful news. The keto diet is great for headaches of all kinds, plus it can help shed extra weight too.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
AussieBrian
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


CH - It's all in your
head!


Posts: 3624
Cairns, Qld, Australia
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #30 - Apr 9th, 2019 at 2:04am
 
I remain thrilled about anything that helps a ClusterHead but I just came across a couple of articles that suggest the keto diet may not be entirely safe or recommended for everyone.

While making no judgement at all,† one way or the other,† I suggest those who are using this method google† 'keto diet dangerous'† and have a little read to ensure they have made a properly informed decision.

Knowledge is the only key we have,

Brian down under.

Back to top
  

My name is Brian. I'm a ClusterHead and I'm here to help. Email me†anytime at briandinkum@yahoo.com
 
IP Logged
 
RightSider
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 21
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #31 - Apr 9th, 2019 at 5:38am
 
Hi Brian, CHDAN & everyone else!

First of all, CHDAN, that's truly fantastic to hear, but to be fair it doesn't surprise me. I am seriously happy for you and can understand how you feel. However, remember that the keto diet is no cure. It just MASSIVELY reduces the chance of having an attack. I've been attack free since around August and off all preventative meds since November. But I get the odd super mild sensation (not even a shadow) every now and then, just to remind me that I'm still a 'clusterhead'! Though to be fair, that only happens when I have alcohol on an empty stomach and after dehydrating†myself through exercise. I like to 'test' myself every now and then!† Wink


Given that the diet has put me into complete remission, got me off ALL medications and made me feel 20 years younger, Iíve spent many hundreds of hours researching it to see whether I may be doing any harm, or indeed killing myself slowly. I have a background in Science (graduated with a BSc), can get my head around most published studies (though certainly no expert!) and understand the importance of Ďobjectivityí very well. Therefore, I have genuinely looked at all sides of the arguments, read as many of the critical studies as I can find, been as objective as possible and looked at the opinions both supporting and discrediting the studies.†

Now, I must stress that the following statements are based on what I have found out over the past 10/11 months and are MY OPINION only. I could waffle on for page after page giving evidence for my conclusions, but I wonít! Iíve tried to be brief and to the point.


1 Nutritional science research, and the conclusions drawn from it, are based on the weakest forms of scientific evidence. It would not be considered even remotely reliable in almost all other areas of science. You could almost give it a Ďjunk statusí rating.

2 The conclusions drawn from this Ďunreliable evidenceí are usually MASSIVELY BIASED. The whole area of nutritional/dietary science has been totally and utterly corrupted/ruined by underlying biased beliefs, agendas, industry influence/pressure and the sources of funding for many of the studies (big food, pharma, religious groups etc, etc). You can discard around 95% of anything you read about diet /nutrition on Google and in newspapers.

3 I cannot stress point 2 enough!

4 All of the studies Iíve come across that criticise keto/lchf diets are complete and utter garbage when you read past the headlines. Seriously, they are a monumental joke and I canít stress that enough. Most of them are also based on diets that arenít even low carb and nowhere near ketogenic! They data has been manipulated to present a bad case for low carb and the conclusions given almost laughable. See points 1 and 2.

5 There are no RCTís (proper evidence!) that have ever shown that a ketogenic diet is bad for your health.

6 There is no proof whatsoever that saturated fat is bad for you. In fact, when clinical trials (not unreliable epidemiological studies which make up the VAST MAJORITY of dietary/nutritional research) have been done, they have shown that saturated fat is benign at worst and protective at best.

7 The food and pharmaceutical industry is terrified of LCHF/keto diets. If everyone started to go low carb, they would lose billions and billions of revenue. They will stop at nothing to try and persuade the general public that they are dangerous. Always keep that in the back of your mind when reading the latest article!

8 We evolved from apes on a ketogenic diet. We are here today because of ketosis and high fat diets. Some Ďexpertsí (with a slightly more objective opinion) say that more research is needed to see if ketogenic diets are safe. What? Isnít millions of years of evolution good enough for you? There has NEVER been any long term study on the safety of HCLF diets, yet weíve been repeatedly told to eat one. Oh, and lets not forget the introduction of dietary guidelines in the 1980ís (which told us all to eat a HCLF diet) has coincided perfectly with a worldwide explosion of obesity and chronic disease. You really couldnít make it up!




To be honest, the scare stories about LCHF diets really p#$$ me off. All the oneís I have researched are all based on complete nonsense and are clearly part of an agenda. Now it is certainly possible that for SOME people, a long term ketogenic diet may not be ideal. But at the moment, there is no evidence to support this either. In the last 30 years the western world has Ďgenerallyí gone high carb and low fat. Over the past 30 years obesity and chronic disease have exploded. Perhaps, just perhaps there is a more dangerous diet out there and maybe, just maybe, itís the one weíve all been told to eat.


Last point. Being chronic, Iíve spent the last 23 years pumping bucket loads of awful drugs into my body, sucking pure oxygen on a daily basis, drinking gallons of energy drinks (last 9/10 years) and experiencing extreme/horrific stress many times a day (and night) for days, weeks and years on end. What do I do now . . . . . NOTHING, except eat a LCHF diet. Iím totally medication, abortive and headache free. I have lost around 30lbs, weigh the same as when I was 16 (now 46), feel amazing, have perfect blood pressure, all other minor health problems have disappeared, I never lack energy, sleep great and have great mental clarity. Before I went keto, got remission and did all those things above to control my clusters (plus lots of other measures i haven't mentioned), nobody said a thing about my long-term health. Now, according to some Ďexpertsí and some of my friends (who believe everything they read on the WWW and newspapers), Iím now heading for a premature death! YRCMIU† Grin


Take care all!

Rightsider
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
AussieBrian
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


CH - It's all in your
head!


Posts: 3624
Cairns, Qld, Australia
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #32 - Apr 9th, 2019 at 6:19am
 
A great post,† RightSider,† and it perfectly proves my suggestion.

We must all look at all the information,† for and against,† so each of us can make an informed decision on how we'll slay this monster.

This is what makes ch.com such a wonderful place to live!



Back to top
  

My name is Brian. I'm a ClusterHead and I'm here to help. Email me†anytime at briandinkum@yahoo.com
 
IP Logged
 
Mike NZ
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


Oxygen rocks! D3 too!


Posts: 3777
Auckland, New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #33 - Apr 10th, 2019 at 3:43am
 
Brian took the words from my keyboard before I could type something very similar.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
jon019
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


"Ya gotta believe!"


Posts: 1632
USA
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #34 - Apr 12th, 2019 at 10:35pm
 
Hiya Rightsider...another rightsider here....


RightSider wrote on Apr 9th, 2019 at 5:38am:
Hi Brian, CHDAN & everyone else!

Now, I must stress that the following statements are based on what I have found out over the past 10/11 months and are MY OPINION only. I could waffle on for page after page giving evidence for my conclusions, but I wonít! Iíve tried to be brief and to the point.

That's fair...good onya...I have an opinion too...being a clusterhead and therefore a skeptic (find that necessary for survival).† full disclosure: not on a keto diet, have not researched, have some general thoughts pro and con that are unimportant to anyone but myself....


1 Nutritional science research, and the conclusions drawn from it, are based on the weakest forms of scientific evidence. It would not be considered even remotely reliable in almost all other areas of science. You could almost give it a Ďjunk statusí rating.

[b]
...WOW that's BROAD...that's the entire field..believe NO ONE?? that's dangerous. my first, thought, for ANY research is: "source"...what is the reputation, the agenda, the 'mission' so to speak. that weeds out a whole lotta garbage...but not ALL. second: "follow the money" who is funding and what is their expectation. BE CAREFUL, corporate America funds all kinds of research...and it's not automatically garbage nor self serving....


2 The conclusions drawn from this Ďunreliable evidenceí are usually MASSIVELY BIASED. The whole area of nutritional/dietary science has been totally and utterly corrupted/ruined by underlying biased beliefs, agendas, industry influence/pressure and the sources of funding for many of the studies (big food, pharma, religious groups etc, etc). You can discard around 95% of anything you read about diet /nutrition on Google and in newspapers.

...confirming your own conclusion there brother. Of course there's a lotta shit out there. it's really shit in-shit out...and saying it's ALL shit don't MAKE it all shit. capitalism and a "free" society do have costs...and MOST ASSUREDLY it's "buyer beware"...so I'm not disagreeing, but cautioning re generalities


3 I cannot stress point 2 enough!

...ever talk to an x smoker re smoking...they tend to be adamant...


4 All of the studies Iíve come across that criticise keto/lchf diets are complete and utter garbage when you read past the headlines. Seriously, they are a monumental joke and I canít stress that enough. Most of them are also based on diets that arenít even low carb and nowhere near ketogenic! They data has been manipulated to present a bad case for low carb and the conclusions given almost laughable. See points 1 and 2.

...'all the studies I'VE come across..." is not ALL the studies



5 There are no RCTís (proper evidence!) that have ever shown that a ketogenic diet is bad for your health.

...well...ok...i'm sure you're a fine fellow...but I don't have to believe that...ya coulda thrown in "yet"...or cited studies showing it WAS good for ya


6 There is no proof whatsoever that saturated fat is bad for you. In fact, when clinical trials (not unreliable epidemiological studies which make up the VAST MAJORITY of dietary/nutritional research) have been done, they have shown that saturated fat is benign at worst and protective at best.

well...wow...that's a whole other subject...I'll hold my opinion


7 The food and pharmaceutical industry is terrified of LCHF/keto diets. If everyone started to go low carb, they would lose billions and billions of revenue. They will stop at nothing to try and persuade the general public that they are dangerous. Always keep that in the back of your mind when reading the latest article!

...like I said...skeptic here...I try and keep my paranoia in check. no illusions re food/pharm (or oil and energy, or banking, or military/industrial, or yadda yadda for that matter), but personally, I think the spawn of Satan dwells in the "health insurance" industry. food and pharma are giant steramrollers... with BILLIONS to burn and they ain't scared of shit....keep yur head on a swivel


8 We evolved from apes on a ketogenic diet. We are here today because of ketosis and high fat diets. Some Ďexpertsí (with a slightly more objective opinion) say that more research is needed to see if ketogenic diets are safe. What? Isnít millions of years of evolution good enough for you? There has NEVER been any long term study on the safety of HCLF diets, yet weíve been repeatedly told to eat one. Oh, and lets not forget the introduction of dietary guidelines in the 1980ís (which told us all to eat a HCLF diet) has coincided perfectly with a worldwide explosion of obesity and chronic disease. You really couldnít make it up![/b]

Öparaphrasing a pre-eminent member here: correlation is not causality.....what about our sedentary lifestyle, environmental pollutants, dangerous food additives, over work/underpay, advances in medical science that extends folks lives and allows for more of the ailments of aging, and on and on.........?


Best

Jon


...another man's opinion...ÖÖ.


Rightsider

Back to top
« Last Edit: Apr 12th, 2019 at 11:26pm by jon019 »  

The LARGE print giveth....and the small print taketh away.    Tom Waits
 
IP Logged
 
RightSider
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 21
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #35 - Apr 14th, 2019 at 4:03am
 
Hi jon019

Thanks for your opinion on my opinions. I have zero problem with that, and I am more than happy for people to disagree with what I wrote.

By the way, I am well aware that correlation does not prove causation. Hence, point number one, though studies on mice, rats, rabbits . .  etc, and 'in-vitro' studies also contributed to my reasoning for that statement.

Take care.

Rightsider
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
RightSider
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 21
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #36 - Apr 14th, 2019 at 2:25pm
 
New paper just out on migraines and ketosis. May be of interest to some?

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Would be interesting to see if a BHB supplement or ketone ester could help with clusters. If it does, it could be a simple/viable med free option for episodic sufferers. Though the far more potent ketone esters cost a small fortune!

Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
jon019
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


"Ya gotta believe!"


Posts: 1632
USA
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #37 - Apr 14th, 2019 at 2:50pm
 
...and nary a fluffy bunny in sight.... Cool

Best

Jon
Back to top
  

The LARGE print giveth....and the small print taketh away.    Tom Waits
 
IP Logged
 
AubanBird
CH.com Veteran
***
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 245
everywhere...
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #38 - Apr 15th, 2019 at 12:32am
 
AussieBrian wrote on Apr 9th, 2019 at 2:04am:
I remain thrilled about anything that helps a ClusterHead but I just came across a couple of articles that suggest the keto diet may not be entirely safe or recommended for everyone.

While making no judgement at all,† one way or the other,† I suggest those who are using this method google† 'keto diet dangerous'† and have a little read to ensure they have made a properly informed decision.

Knowledge is the only key we have,

Brian down under.




Very fair point.†

While catching up on this thread, i was thinking...† there isnt a specific ketogenic diet.† Everyone has their own version of it.† Some people go straight to red meats and fats and almost nothing else, while others try to include as much leafy greens as possible.†

Personally, i believe that a more varied diet is better.† It goes back to the reason you dont eat a carnivores liver...† too much of a good thing can be toxic.† But i have an unusual diet, so i figured i would share it.† It changes from day to day, but ill try to include most of what i eat when im away and when i am home.

When home, i eat a lot of microgreens, eggs, and every kind of meat.† I eat a lot of fat in red meats, mainly because i like it.† I have always liked the fatty parts of a steak.† I grow my own microgreens both at home and away.† Sunflowers, rape sprouts, broccoli, and radish mostly.† If i am home in the summer, i also collect and eat a lot of wild mustard, curly dock, greater plantain, narrow leaf(ribwort) plantain, dandelion, wild onion, kudzu, sheeps sorrel, and chickweed.† They all grow abundantly on my property.† I go easy on the sheeps sorrel and curly dock because they are both high in oxylates, but i still probably eat more than i should...† I also grow and occasionally eat mealworms.† They mix well with a soup i make out of sheeps sorrel.† I occasionally eat spiders, grasshoppers, and crickets as well.†

Anyway, when i am deployed, i usually eat eggs and veggies, with occasional meats.† My main source of protien is usually eggs in third world countries.† Sometimes bugs, if a local shows me which ones are safe and how to prepare them.† I also eat local weeds, again if i can find a local to show me which ones are safe.†

Basically, i eat a lot of different things.† I have known people who tried to switch to a ketogenic diet and pretty much just ate nothing but red meat, and they suffered for it.† I wouldn't reccomend it...


My suggestion to anyone trying to go keto is to maintain a varied diet.† I have never focused on trying to build up ketones in my body.† I dont try to cram extra fat into my diet.† I just avoid carbs, but ill eat just about anything else.† Unless of course all i have is MRE's.†

If anyone is feeling adventurous and wants to try collecting wild foods, have someone show them to you first.† Learn their identifying characteristics.† It is not hard to learn, just dont learn it from a book the first time you try it.† I cant stress this enough!† And if you want to try eating a bug, cook it first.† Especially spiders.† Most of them are safe to eat after they are cooked, but you probably dont even want to know what COULD be growing inside them...†

Anyway, im glad to hear that others are finding relief by going keto.† Just remember to keep a varied diet.† Meat alone doesnt have everything...

Back to top
« Last Edit: Apr 15th, 2019 at 12:34am by AubanBird »  
 
IP Logged
 
Constantine
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 26
West Palm Beach, Florida
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #39 - Apr 26th, 2019 at 12:38am
 
Hey guys. Day 19 of keto for me. Iíve dropped from 200 to 190 already and I do admittedly feel quite a bit better overall. Iíll write a more lengthy post about my cluster situation as well as my double frozen shoulder situation at some point in the future when Iíve done this diet for a few more months, but Iím hopeful over these early returns. I still have shoulder pain but my right shoulder has shown signs of small improvement since doing this.

Anyway, Iím eating bacon daily. I feel pretty good overall, and I am in ketosis pretty strongly. I havenít had any sugar or bad carbs for 19 straight days, so at least on that front Iím good. Lots of olive oil, veggies, avocados, walnuts and eggs too. No fruit, minimal dairy but I am having cream with coffee every morning.

Again I feel pretty good, but I really need my shoulder disease to retreat just as much as I need to never have another cluster headache.

Are you guys cool with bacon being a part of our respective recoveries? Now learning what I know about my past bad diet and these auto immune issues Iím battling, I want to give my body a chance to heal from it all. I just hope bacon isnít an impediment to that. I think itís probaby fine but I do wonder.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3542
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #40 - Apr 26th, 2019 at 7:18am
 
Hey Constantine,

Bacon is a staple for me on the Atkins-Keto diet.  For a real treat, I chop up 3 to 4 slices of slightly crisp but not over done bacon, add one small jalapeŮo pepper (split with seeds and placenta scraped out, rinsed then chopped in very small pieces) in a blender, then melt two sticks of butter and pour into the mix and buzz for a few seconds.  I pour it into a tub I can seal and refrigerate. 

A scoop of this bacon-jalapeŮo flavored butter allowed to melt on top of a steak, hamburger, broiled/grilled fish, shrimp or lobster and steamed veggies brings out a wonderful flavor that will make you, your family and guests want more...

Take care,

V/R, Batch
Back to top
  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, thatís as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
AussieBrian
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


CH - It's all in your
head!


Posts: 3624
Cairns, Qld, Australia
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #41 - Apr 26th, 2019 at 11:49pm
 
Hey, Batch. Having made your delicious and very nutritious butter mix consider putting it onto plastic wrap and rolling it to resemble a section of broom handle. (Ask your wife to show you one.)

Freeze it in the plastic then when you're ready to start cooking the bbq for friends simply unwrap the roll and slice it into nice thick discs which you drop into a jug of iced water and leave on the table so guests can put their own pieces onto their chosen lump of cooked animal.

Other butter mixes include garlic, rosemary and parsely if it's lamb or lime juice and lemon zest for seafood.

Even better is that you can make it weeks in advance.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Apr 26th, 2019 at 11:52pm by AussieBrian »  

My name is Brian. I'm a ClusterHead and I'm here to help. Email me†anytime at briandinkum@yahoo.com
 
IP Logged
 
AussieBrian
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


CH - It's all in your
head!


Posts: 3624
Cairns, Qld, Australia
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #42 - Apr 26th, 2019 at 11:51pm
 
We now return to our regular program.
Back to top
  

My name is Brian. I'm a ClusterHead and I'm here to help. Email me†anytime at briandinkum@yahoo.com
 
IP Logged
 
Constantine
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 26
West Palm Beach, Florida
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #43 - Apr 27th, 2019 at 4:54pm
 
Thanks for the reply, Batch, as always. Bacon has been a staple of my keto lifestyle as well. Iíll eat maybe 320 kcal worth of it per day.

Iím really going out of my way to incorporate as many green veggies, avocado, raw walnuts, and uncooked olive oil as I can, but Iím glad bacon can be apart of this too. I get the sense that fatty bacon can be nutritious as long as one is not eating sugar and excess carbs and what not.

Anyway, itís day 21 for me here. In moderate ketosis at the moment. My mind has been clearer and my chronic pain has been down a good percentage. Iím very eager to see where Iím at after a couple months worth of this lifestyle. Itís a great feeling having genuine hope.  Smiley
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Mike NZ
CH.com Hall of Famer
*****
Offline


Oxygen rocks! D3 too!


Posts: 3777
Auckland, New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #44 - Apr 27th, 2019 at 8:57pm
 
I'm just over 2 months in and it has done wonders.

The effects have been, so far:
  • lost over 14Kg (over 2 stone)
  • a lot more energy
  • migraines have gone from multiple per week (even with D3) to maybe once a month


I do miss sweet stuff but then I look at what I've benefited from by avoiding it too.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
chrismo5555
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


Vitamin D3 is for me!


Posts: 11
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #45 - Jun 1st, 2019 at 8:49am
 
Hey Everyone! Loving this thread. Interesting info, mixed with polite responses. Wow Smiley

I started Keto two weeks ago and am loving it so far. I'm doing it to drop some weight before my wedding. I did Atkins when I was 18 and lost quite a bit of weight pretty quickly and all the fitness folks on social media have been raving about Keto, so I thought I would give it a try.

My CH started a few weeks after I turned 16. Back then I treated with prednisone and inderall. It worked for 2 cycles then stopped. Cycles were coming every 3-4 months for about 4-6 weeks. I then started experimenting with shrroms, rc seeds, etc. but never could get that in-line to be effective and reliable.

When I did Atkins at age 18, I noticed quite a while had gone by without a cycle! It has been a long time since then, so I don't remember the exact timing, sorry! But it had been well, well past when I should have experienced a cycle.

I posted about this when I was 18 and actually got shut down pretty hard by a lot of people on these boards. Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

It's funny what a difference 18 years make. A huge majority of people on this board back then were of the idea that food has *absolutely nothing* to do with CH. Now I think most people would agree that altering your diet can definitely improve CH.

Anyway, I'm kind of rambling. I guess there are just a few key points I'd like to make:

1) Thank you for being more receptive to people's ideas and not shutting folks down.
2) Every different food we put into our bodies creates a *unique* reaction inside of us and has some sort of *unique* impact on our bodies.

As for 33 year old me? My cycles have been getting further and further apart the older I get. The last couple of cycles had ~3 year remission periods between them. I manage them with Vitamin regimen (shoutout to Batch!) and Oxygen/Ice at home. I basically don't leave the house for 6 weeks, work from home, and my 6 week cycle is really only hellish for about 2 weeks. The other time is actually really manageable.

In the future when a cycle comes, I'm going to do Keto diet and see how it helps.

I know I don't post often, but this board has been a huge part of my life since I was a teenager. I could not have more love for this place!!! <3

Thanks -Chris
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
pattik
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline




Posts: 2599
Wisconsin, USA
Gender: female
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #46 - Jun 1st, 2019 at 9:12am
 
Awesome post, Chris. I enjoyed reading the old thread. I canít really add much, since I havenít tried it yet, but Iím just happy to know you have kept track of and benefitted from this site all these years. Thanks for posting and pointing out how viewpoints can change. Congrats on your upcoming wedding! Smiley
Patti
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 1st, 2019 at 9:14am by pattik »  
 
IP Logged
 
CHDAN
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 3
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #47 - Jun 12th, 2019 at 11:41pm
 
Well its coming up 6 months now on the keto lifestyle and it feels like things only continue to get better. Was still getting the very odd weak shadow in the morning at times but now I dont get anything. I even felt confident to have a bit of a cheat day with a small amount of sweet food and 2 beers and still felt fine. Im a picture of health compared to how I was and all my doctors are very happy with what Im doing. My cardiologist is also happy with my heart health aswell and is on board.
If you told me a year ago I would be feeling this good from a diet, I would have never believed you. Its a drastic turn around from being in agony everyday for years to being 100% headache free and full of energy.
I dont count calories, I eat bacon and eggs every morning and a good size lunch and a big dinner with keto deserts before bed. I eat what ever I want as long as its very low carb. Im 78 kgs (171lb) at 6 foot 1 I was about 95kgs (209lb) when I started. My weight has been steady for the last month or so. I also never thought I had that much fat to loose.
Onward and Upwards! wow does it feel good to be normal and im sure as hell not going to take it for granted!
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Constantine
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 26
West Palm Beach, Florida
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #48 - Jul 23rd, 2019 at 4:25pm
 
CHDAN wrote on Jun 12th, 2019 at 11:41pm:
Well its coming up 6 months now on the keto lifestyle and it feels like things only continue to get better. Was still getting the very odd weak shadow in the morning at times but now I dont get anything. I even felt confident to have a bit of a cheat day with a small amount of sweet food and 2 beers and still felt fine. Im a picture of health compared to how I was and all my doctors are very happy with what Im doing. My cardiologist is also happy with my heart health aswell and is on board.
If you told me a year ago I would be feeling this good from a diet, I would have never believed you. Its a drastic turn around from being in agony everyday for years to being 100% headache free and full of energy.
I dont count calories, I eat bacon and eggs every morning and a good size lunch and a big dinner with keto deserts before bed. I eat what ever I want as long as its very low carb. Im 78 kgs (171lb) at 6 foot 1 I was about 95kgs (209lb) when I started. My weight has been steady for the last month or so. I also never thought I had that much fat to loose.
Onward and Upwards! wow does it feel good to be normal and im sure as hell not going to take it for granted!


This post made my day. Thank you for this.

As for me... 109 days now I think? Something like that. No backsliding. Hashtag Keto Life.

I've gone from 200 to 176. I feel great. Only mild shadows at times, but overall, what a blessing this has been. My next cycle was due around July 15th, so every day has been nerve-wracking since, but the cycle just hasn't shown up.

Fingers crossed this is the answer to my prayers. Clusters since 1996, so if this is real, I'm going to have a chance at a full life finally. I'll update you guys in a couple months at the latest.

Have a great day, everyone. I love you all.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
CHDAN
CH.com Newbie
*
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 3
Re: Keto diet and cluster headaches
Reply #49 - Aug 23rd, 2019 at 2:55am
 
Just a short progress report.
About 9 months now and still feel great. Cluster Headaches and medications are thing of the past for me. Feels like my brain is working better and better in general as each month rolls by. 
Pain Free Wishes To All
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print

DISCLAIMER: All information contained on this web site is for informational purposes only.  It is in no way intended to be used as a replacement for professional medical treatment.   clusterheadaches.com makes no claims as to the scientific/clinical validity of the information on this site OR to that of the information linked to from this site.  All information taken from the internet should be discussed with a medical professional!