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Topic: LSA vs. other alternatives (Read 2598 times) |
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bruceg
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #50 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 3:29pm » |
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Just to put in my 2 cents:
I've just started to test out LSA in the form of Woodrose seeds. first a little back ground. 47, have had CH for 10 years, typically 2 cycles of 6 to 8 weeks a year. Last couple of years, have tapered off to 1 cycle every other year, but cycle lasts 8 to 12 weeks.
Have tried all abortives and most prophelactives, O2 is the only one that works (90% of the time) of which I can stand the side effects.
HA Patterns are generally at night (I can set a clock by the first one which comes at 1:00AM) with follow on attacks every two hours until morning.
Other than that, of course, the ingestion of alchoal, at almost any amount during a cycle will bring on an attack.
So, a week ago I tried using Woodrose Seeds ordered from iamshaman.com. Cracked open two seeds, extracted the center, chopped them up and brewed them in hot water for several minutes. Adding suger (they taste awfull) and peppermint tea I swallowed the brew down.
No real physical effect except for me mild stomach discomfort that may have just been what I ate that day.
The result was a completely CH free night...albiet with a mild "hangover" type headache in the morning. Was even able to tolerate two drinks the following day without setting off a CH. Following two days, vaugue shadows, but nothing requiring O2, even though I took a cautious drink or two.
However, four days later I got walloped by a pretty big CH right before bedtime.
I'm still cautiously optimistic about this form of treatment, but was pretty upset about the latest CH.
Will be trying a stronger dose later today...figured its fathers day and if trip out, hey, its my day aint it?
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vig
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #51 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 3:39pm » |
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cool!
but this time don't push your luck and leave the boozy behind.
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Pinkfloyd
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #52 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 3:52pm » |
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I think it's a very good idea to stay as far away from ANY triggers as possible for a while to give the system a chance to settle back into non-cluster mode. Much easier to rekindle a fire when the embers are still hot.
Happy Father's Day
Bobw
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cazman
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #53 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 4:06pm » |
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its fathers day been a very very rough 3 days for me getting hit way to much i had planned on doseing again today but my house is full of family and i just can dose with this many peeps around so im holding off till toarrow morning first thing so i can spend the day in lala land with distration and nosy morons around, i love my family very much but if one more of them say take two motrin and take a nap im gonna shoot them all, sometimes i wish i could have them expeirence just one ch so they shut the fuck up sorry im really frustrated and the guy who was supposed to hook me up with o2 today blew me off and im i wanna send the bad man to fix him lol thanks for listenning , i now return you to your scheduled progarm
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jokrs2
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #54 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 4:30pm » |
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Hey Bruce.
Your first test sounds pretty typical. Congrats!
It's not necessary to use hot water in the extraction process, (see Hofmanns research..Erowid.com). Also, it is a good idea to fast and even skip a meal before you dose as this will lessen the stomach discomfort. Some gas and possibly a little diarhea is possible. Gatorade is what I use as a supplement during this stage of the journey. Rivea Corymbosa is also easier on the stomach than the HBWR in my personal experience. Agree completely with BobW., stay away from those triggers, ie..alcohol etc..
Regards, Joe
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| « Last Edit: Jun 19th, 2005, 4:32pm by jokrs2 » |
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bruceg
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #55 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 5:14pm » |
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I've always had an 'emotional' concern that HA caused by external triggers--outside of the pain the cause--extended or somehow modified the CH episode. However, my research (and my doctor's opinion along with that of my brother who's also a doc) says it doesn't make a difference. So, why do it? Well, I want to know if it works!
The big problem (and its not as big as those who have chronic or even more frequent epsiodes, I know) is that, how do you know a treatment works or you just reached the end of the cycle.
So, by puposefully "pulling a trigger" I'm just trying to gather real facts. (And know, I'm not really a matyr, but I do normally have a pretty high pain treashold.)
Hopefully, I'm on the last legs of this monster, as my type of presentation generally assumes that I'll have less and less epsiodes...but, not to whine because again I see that there are those sufferring a lot worse than I...but its almost more disruptive due to its infrequency. I have my own business which requires travel. And so far, I've had to cancel two trips (can you image trying to get 02 tanks onboard a plane right now?
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Chillrmn1
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #56 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 5:44pm » |
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Hey Bruce,
Seems the LSA helps you and is effective for your clusters and glad for you. IMHO, if I were you, I'd lay off the alcohol a little longer and not try to test the beast so soon. The LSA treatment for CH is relatively new, at least as far as recent posts/reports go as I can find. It's possible a healing process or other type mechanism, ie., chemical balancing, etc., is taking place which/that needs a few days to take place or complete. Just my 2 cents, but I wouldn't test/force/tempt the beast out so soon after dosing with known triggers. I was so glad to get my relief with LSA, that no way was I going to play with the beast. You see, I went thru hell for 8 1/2 months and wasn't going to do anything to jepordize my PF time finally found.
Again, just my 2 cents and wishing you the best.
Bob
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cazman
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #57 on: Jun 19th, 2005, 9:22pm » |
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i figured out a 3 years ago the any form of alcohol triggers the beast so needless to say i havent had a drink in 3 years and till they find a staight out cure i wont start again, now if we could perscribe ch to alcoholics there might be less drunks out there
not that i want anyone to feel the beast
i dont even use mouthwash with alcohol in it
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bruceg
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #58 on: Jun 20th, 2005, 12:03am » |
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Understand, and appriciate the concern. I honestly think I can count myself amongst the more fortunete ones as my epsiodes of late have not been too servere, certainly not as bad as previous years: hitting my head so hard against a wall, it went right through...and that was a lath a plaster wall!
Anyway, I really do want to find what it takes to kill it off, and know how well it does it. As I mentioned before, my big fustration is that, since my cycles are somewhat short, I never really know what works and what's just the end of the cycle. Right now, I'm in the middle of what would normally be a typical cycle.
Just as an update, I took a small does (one seed) this morning and other than a strong (but not painful) shadow...things are ok. Even had a glass of wine with dinner (yea I know, you can say I told you so if I come begging for sympathy tomorrow  ).
So, its still looking positive on the long term outcome. Some further reading seems to suggest a regime of small daily doses over larger doses spread out over three to seven days....more on everything later.
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Pinkfloyd
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #59 on: Jun 20th, 2005, 12:14am » |
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on Jun 19th, 2005, 5:14pm, bruceg wrote:
The big problem (and its not as big as those who have chronic or even more frequent epsiodes, I know) is that, how do you know a treatment works or you just reached the end of the cycle.
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I understand what you were trying to do, or discover, but don't know how this would have answered your question one way or the other.
on Jun 19th, 2005, 5:14pm, bruceg wrote:
So, by puposefully "pulling a trigger" I'm just trying to gather real facts. (And know, I'm not really a matyr, but I do normally have a pretty high pain treashold.)
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Again, I understand your point and we aren't trying to just give you a hard time here.
We aren't sure that breaking a cycle with psychedelics is doing so through the same mechanisms as a natural remission. Usually, at the time of a natural remission, triggers lose their ability to "trigger" very quickly and if the cycle is over, a beer the next day probably won't make a difference, as you and your docs suggest.
A psychedelic break may be a bit different and it seems a bit more tenuous. You need a little more time to allow things to settle down.
Also, during a natural remission, it gets there when it gets there. Your system sort of settles down on its own as the remission begins and when you realize the cycle is over, you've gone through that period already where you've stayed away from triggers during this remission period. For some, clusters go away very quickly as the remission begins. For others, the attacks may slowly lose severity and frequency.
During this attempt at an induced break (psychedelics) the natural slowdown or (healing) that takes place over some time period, isn't present. You need to give the neurological system a chance to catch up. One of those, "wait a minute, what's going on, we weren't ready for this" sort of things.
So, some of us think that by adding triggers just to test the waters, if done too soon, may be prolonging this cooling off period and the cycle itself.
BobW
(yes, just a theory but we are trying to determine why, and explain why, many people take longer to break cycles than others. In many cases, there is still a
trigger(s) present during the times people are trying to break the cycles with psychedelics)
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"Nothing is so firmly believed as what we least know."
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[Michel de Montaigne
www.clusterbusters.com
www.obscuredview.blogspot.com
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Chillrmn1
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #60 on: Jun 20th, 2005, 6:09am » |
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Hey cazman,
I can relate with you on the alcohol. Once I figured it was a trigger years back, I quit. My damn attacks were so extreme I was going to stop or block as many avenues as possible hoping the beast would get lost and not find my pain address. Another plus to this...........no more hangovers and more money in my pocket..........sorry for those of you holding stock in Smirnoff, stock must have started to plummet at that time.
Bob
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bruceg
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #61 on: Jun 20th, 2005, 3:12pm » |
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on Jun 20th, 2005, 12:14am, Pinkfloyd wrote:
A psychedelic break may be a bit different and it seems a bit more tenuous. You need a little more time to allow things to settle down.
Also, during a natural remission, it gets there when it gets there. Your system sort of settles down on its own as the remission begins and when you realize the cycle is over, you've gone through that period already where you've stayed away from triggers during this remission period. For some, clusters go away very quickly as the remission begins. For others, the attacks may slowly lose severity and frequency.
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Interesting thought. According to some newer information I have heard and seen around, the "cycle" is also tied to an individuals Circadian cycle. So, you idea that you can't "opt out" of a cycle would hold water...you can simply mask or block the effect of the cycle. So, Ok, I'll go with no alcohol and continue the experiment. (Its not like I can't go without it...the biggest issue is that we are I guess what you'd call "foodies" and wine an essential part of that experiance...so, that's not that big of a deal...had to give up bacon years ago<G>
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cazman
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #62 on: Jun 20th, 2005, 5:09pm » |
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thanks chill now i know why i lost money on that stock lol
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cazman
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Re: LSA vs. other alternatives
« Reply #63 on: Jun 21st, 2005, 12:12pm » |
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did another dose last night 4.5 grams of morning glory seeds once again no side affects other than i medium trip effect took them at 8pm its now around 12pm next day been pf so far no shadows nothing little hangover type thing but not bad i wanna thank the people that were in chat last night it help keep me in line mentally i will keep yall update as to how long it last this time around .
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