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Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback?? (Read 23731 times)
seasonalboomer
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #75 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 5:09am
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 12th, 2008 at 9:21pm:
first, my thanks for the kind posts, it was this level of discourse I was most hoping for when I first posted. I have to learn patience.


Smiley
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #76 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:04pm
 
Thanks Boomer,

Right according to the book. Utterly predictable.

Wow, I'm blown away... So many ways I want to respond but just can't seem to figure out how.

And now the drama and victimology phase of your little play.
Completely consistent with a particular M.O.

For some reason I'm attracted to reading posts like this. Maybe not attracted, but that same feeling you get when you hear someone say something really stupid and you pause to hear what is going to come next.

Do you need a hug?

I've already guessed your next response

(with apologies to the original author of these
pithy little repartees, I'm not my eloquent self
right this minute, really nasty one...Chris)



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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #77 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:19pm
 

Ohforpetessake.   Roll Eyes
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #78 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:19pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:04pm:
Thanks Boomer,

Right according to the book. Utterly predictable.

And he is right.

Wow, I'm blown away... So many ways I want to respond but just can't seem to figure out how.

I am too because you just don't get it.

And now the drama and victimology phase of your little play.
Completely consistent with a particular M.O.

Been going for a week now.

For some reason I'm attracted to reading posts like this. Maybe not attracted, but that same feeling you get when you hear someone say something really stupid and you pause to hear what is going to come next.

Same thing next.

Do you need a hug?

No, I'm working the O2 valve for every breath.

I've already guessed your next response

Same old AK Philosophy.

(I'm not my eloquent self
right this minute, Chris)

No, you are not.



Rolo... Smiley
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« Last Edit: Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:31pm by N/A »  
 
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seasonalboomer
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #79 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:52pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:04pm:
Thanks Boomer


You're welcome.

But before I finish let me make sure I put the words "APPLIED KINESIOLOGY" into the post so that you can feel the level of discourse met your expectations/needs. It is, apparently, all about your needs here on this thread.
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #80 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:58pm
 
Applied Kinesiology?

Interesting concept, can you explain it to the list?

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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #81 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:13pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 13th, 2008 at 8:58pm:
Applied Kinesiology?

Interesting concept, can you explain it to the list?



I can explain it Chris, It’s a load of crap perpetuated by holistic wallet scrapers.
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Racer1_NC
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #82 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:30pm
 
Ya know.....this thread is starting to get a tad old.
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seasonalboomer
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #83 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:38pm
 
Racer1_NC wrote on Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:30pm:
Ya know.....this thread is starting to get a tad old.


Ya think?
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #84 - Dec 13th, 2008 at 9:46pm
 
Maybe now this thread can slip into oblivion?

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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #85 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 2:02am
 
Quote:
Racer1_NC wrote on Yesterday at 21:30:54:
Ya know.....this thread is starting to get a tad old.


Quote:
Posted by: Linda_Howell Posted on: Yesterday at 21:46:47
Maybe now this thread can slip into oblivion?


Linda / Bill (racer), I don’t see why would you want to stop this thread, I start to regard this thread as my daily read, as I do in the newspaper, at the end the comics, its just makes me laugh, the literary back and force, with the “hidden” innuendos, it is just simply fun to read….. and seems to get the outmost of the participants……


Michael


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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #86 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 8:15am
 
wildhaus wrote on Dec 9th, 2008 at 11:26am:
it is rather a “nice” way to make money on the back of the sufferers!

And therefore I am out of this discussion, I fell we are discussing a futile matter.

Michael

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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #87 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 8:40am
 
Kevin, I do not join the course, the same way I do not write the comics in the newspaper, I simply have a good laugh……

Michael
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #88 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 9:07am
 
Amusement can come and go.
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #89 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 10:19am
 
I'm with you Michael, The daily interplay, and seeing the reactions pro and con is fascinating.

Also, doing site research is interesting, btw, nice job you and the others did on the O2 CH Abortive paper, people should just print that one off and give it to any doctor who balks at giving an O2 prescription.

Also interesting, if someone hasn't figured it out, to tap on individual names and go to the icon that displays their last 50 messages. Some people do seem to be on the attack most of the time, some who I was wondering about, seem to have some serious depth to them. Mea Culpa!

There was a suggestion in one thread to read the Dr Robbins page for research:
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Certainly worth reading, if nothing else, to point out the lack of recent substantive research on CH.

One somewhat dated survey caught my attention, allow me to clip:

Eighty-three percent of survey respondents qualified as CH sufferers according to IHS criteria. However, diagnosis was delayed an average of 6.6 years from onset of symptoms. The average number of physicians seen before the correct diagnosis was made was 4.3 and the average number of incorrect diagnoses was 3.9. Seventy-one percent of respondents had undergone unnecessary MRI's or CT scans and four percent had unnecessary sinus or deviated septum surgery. We found that inappropriate medications such as propanolol, amitriptyline, and antibiotics were prescribed and that successful medications for CH such as Imitrex and oxygen were often denied due to a failure to understand the nature of this disorder. Seventy-seven percent of respondents were smokers which correlates with previously published data. Seventy-four percent stopped smoking in an attempt to improve their condition, however, only 3% experienced relief.

If I'm reading correctly, standard medical practice in year 2000, delayed CH treatment by an average of 6 years, and the average sufferer had to endure 4 misdiagnoses and see 4 doctors before someone got it right, with the majority of sufferers enduring ct's, mri's and ineffectatious courses of drug treatments, all, of course, were even given free by the providers, or at least given with a money back guarantee.

I have been challenged for my questioning of standard medicine, also "Pharm Bashing", perhaps rightly so. Perhaps though, I am not totally off the mark.

I also note a recurring thesis that all non standard medicine is simply a money gouging fraud. As I chop my pills into one quarters, grateful that the 1/4 seems to help my headaches, I note that the average cost of an entire course of treatment from my non standard practitioner, costs less than a single month's prescription, (and I have two prescriptions), less than any Cat Scan, MRI, Neurological workup, Headache Clinic or whatever.

Opposing any treatment simply on a cost basis, is an argument without merit. Go on, just tell me that a tank of Oxygen costs too much, we shouldn't use it.

Heck, well educated, well intentioned doctors misdiagnose, and deny even the most basic relief, like O2, all the time, look at the studies, go back and read the threads. I don't condemn them, it is a product of ignorance, and a system awash in billions of dollars, dominated by corporations, insurance forms  and HMO's, where it is easier to justify a cat scan than a bottle of oxygen.

If I have a fight here, I guess it is against ignorance. The ignorance of a new CH sufferer, who might not even know what they have, and certainly hasn't heard about the neat things we discuss on all these threads. The ignorance of individual doctors, a la the Robbins paper, who just haven't taken or don't have the time to study up, and don't have the humility to say "I don't know". Last, as one might infer, the ignorance of those who say "N0, no, no", when they might better be saying "I don't know, maybe?".

For those of you complaining the thread is getting old, PLEASE, there is no gun pointed at your head. There are other threads I find boring or shallow, but rather than try to censor and in effect denigrate them, I have a great new trick.

I don't read them any more.

God bless all the posters I've read over this period. Ranting, philosophical, in pain, challenging, argumentative, off the wall, whining, dictatorial,  they all have their places. Take them all with a grain of salt, believe them or don't believe them, but in the long run, we have to hope the average reader has the hutzpah to separate the crap from the petunias, and hopefully walk away with an occasional flower, while not smelling too bad. Correct me if I'm wrong, isn't there something in the Constitution about that, its sort of a very American concept.

Anyway, I'm in a great mood, 8 1/2 hours of sleep, sun is shining on all the damned ice on everything, God Awesome beautiful, and it's my boy's 12th birthday. Doesn't get too much better than that.

To all my new friends, Rolo, Jimi, Kevin, Boomer,Racer, Linda, Michael I can only wish you a PF day, and a few moments to stop and smell the roses, or petunias, or whatever good things come your way today.

Best,

Chris





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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #90 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 1:14pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 6th, 2008 at 7:27am:
...AK might be something we want to at least look at.  It might not have any validity for anyone else, but my question is if anyone else has tried it, what were your results, and is this something we should put in our bag of CH tricks either after everything else has failed, or, God forbid, as a primary treatment for CH?



wildhaus wrote on Dec 9th, 2008 at 11:26am:
...it is rather a “nice” way to make money on the back of the sufferers!

And therefore I am out of this discussion, I fell we are discussing a futile matter.

Michael



fly gas wrote on Dec 14th, 2008 at 10:19am:
I'm with you Michael, The daily interplay, and seeing the reactions pro and con is fascinating.

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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #91 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 1:31pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 14th, 2008 at 10:19am:
some who I was wondering about, seem to have some serious depth to them. Mea Culpa!


You can pretty much count on the fact that if someone has been here several years they aren't simply trolls or hanger's on, looking for fight. This community doesn't support such long term behavior. It's a straighten-up-and-fly-right kind of world here. Either pitch in and get serious about being a member of the community or quit stirring shit up every post.
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #92 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 1:52pm
 
I personally think Fly Gas and Annsie make some very valid points worth some serious consideration, yet many of you are hell bent on just shutting them down because as Seasonal Boomer says
"It's a straighten-up-and-fly-right kind of world here. Either pitch in and get serious about being a member of the community or quit stirring shit up every post."


That is a sad commentary on a community of caring and empathetic people dealing with a lot of pain in their lives.

Perhaps for those that do not want to just talk about O2 and verapamil and Lithium, a separate new folder could be created in the Cluster Headache Help and Support section of the forum possibly entitled something like Personal Experiences with Alternative Therapies
 This section could be for those intractable types that are looking to try anything to find pain relief, when regular medical science has failed them.

There should be a compassionate place for all CH people here IMO

Moderators...is this a possibility?



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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #93 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 2:30pm
 
You are talking to the wrong people. This would be something that you would have to ask DJ about. He is the administrator.

You state that
Quote:
, yet many of you are hell bent on just shutting them down
and...
Quote:
That is a sad commentary on a community of caring and empathetic people dealing with a lot of pain in their lives.


When a new person comes in and makes a statement like that to a board that has been here 10 years, well you aren't gonna win friends and influence people.

Do you think that everything being discuseed here has never been discussed in the past, debated about, tried, reported on, accepted or rejected? None of this is new and if we have offended you then you can do one of two things. You can join us and grab an oar or you can go start your own site. This is my personal feeling about it.

As a Moderator if we were hellbent on shutting down this thread. If we wanted to lock it, we would have done so a long time ago.


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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #94 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 2:36pm
 
If you’ve got the time for this Chris, Ive got the popcorn. Smiley
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #95 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 2:48pm
 
fly gas, have you tried the Clusterbuster method?
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #96 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 3:14pm
 
"You are talking to the wrong people. This would be something that you would have to ask DJ about. He is the administrator."
Thank you...maybe he will see this.

"well you aren't gonna win friends and influence people."..
I am not running for political office

I believe it was a couple of moderators on this page of discussion that indicated that the discussion was getting a
"tad old",
and
"Maybe now this thread can slip into oblivion?"


"if we have offended you"
no...you missed my point

I was not looking to have the thread locked, just to have attention of the mods drawn to a point that i thought my be important to a few...that there may be merit in having a place somewhere to list other persons' positive experiences with alternative non traditional treatments of CH for those intractable sufferers that have been non responsive to traditional therapies....fly gas experience with his method would be one, chiropractic may be another, hormone replacement therapy may be another etc.

sorry for the inconvenience caused by introducing the idea in the midst of this thread....carry on


Paul
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #97 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 5:11pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 14th, 2008 at 10:19am:
God bless all the posters I've read over this period. Ranting, philosophical, in pain, challenging, argumentative, off the wall, whining, dictatorial,  they all have their places. Take them all with a grain of salt, believe them or don't believe them, but in the long run, we have to hope the average reader has the hutzpah to separate the crap from the petunias, and hopefully walk away with an occasional flower, while not smelling too bad.


I'm not sure I agree with anything else you've said, but Bravo for this little gem. If we all agreed on everything, and our world was only filled with rainbows and unicorns and visions of sugarplums, it would be a boring existance.  Smiley
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #98 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 5:35pm
 
Well, K is still misquoting posts, boomer is firmly convinced he is in charge, but the idea of a separate category for alternative medicine is not a bad idea, darn good one in fact.

Why people who don't like what I write, keep coming back and reading it really escapes me. I guess my First Amendment idea didn't pass muster.

Perhaps some people have it that they are the only ones under the sun with the lofty intellects to separate the wheat from the chaff, and they are the only ones who can save us mortals from ourselves. Must be nice.........

I'm tired, I think the dead horse swings both ways.

Pixie, never tried clusterbusters. This episode is just under control, should it change for the worse, I'll probably give it a try. anyone ever try dried peyote buttons for CH? They used to be my favorite.........
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Re: Does Applied Kinesiology Help Clusters? Feedback??
Reply #99 - Dec 14th, 2008 at 6:18pm
 
fly gas wrote on Dec 14th, 2008 at 5:35pm:
Why people who don't like what I write, keep coming back and reading it really escapes me.



Kevin_M wrote on Dec 8th, 2008 at 12:46pm:
Please distinguish for us average people which are the bizarre and which have been debunked.


Kevin_M wrote on Dec 8th, 2008 at 5:17pm:
You can point out where I've misquoted and twisted for more constructive criticism.




It's been six days.  Or is it just more convenient to see your own typed words: bizarre, debunked, and misquote.
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