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Topic: 5-HT activity in Kudzu (Read 32692 times) |
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Boyce
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #325 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 10:20am » |
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on Mar 7th, 2005, 9:13am, nani wrote:I like your analogy, boomer. I got hit yesterday, or mini-hit, if you will. I was telling my husband that it was like there was a "barrier" between the pain and my pain receptors. It only lasted about 10 minutes and didn't go over a 3...but it was a hit. Came on fast and with intensity. Lots of shadows over the weekend and I'm probably going to add another 750 mgs today. So my total daily will be 2250 mgs. Still thinking that this is a whole lot better than before. 
Question Flo...Are phyto estrogens the same kind one would get in "bio-identical" HRT? I used oral estrogen for years that did nothing. My accupuncturist prescribed bio-identical hormones (applied on the skin) and there was an instant improvement. I'm not using them now...just wondering. |
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Whole-E-Cow!!! 2250mg???? If I go over about 750mg in a day's time I get all dizzy and light headed....but the Zu is doing well for me so far....day 4 and no real hits, just some shadows, and not over kip 2/3 or so....I'm taking 150mg solaray capsules....150mg before breakfast, 150mg before lunch, 150 before dinner, and 150 more with my melatonin/benadryl at bedtime...(I also take enteric coated aspirin throughout the day to keep the shadows in line and my blood thin)
You must have a better tolerance for it than I do.....if I even take 2 capsules (300mg) at the same time, it makes we weak and dizzy.... 
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floridian
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #326 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 11:21am » |
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on Mar 7th, 2005, 9:13am, nani wrote:
Question Flo...Are phyto estrogens the same kind one would get in "bio-identical" HRT? I used oral estrogen for years that did nothing. My accupuncturist prescribed bio-identical hormones (applied on the skin) and there was an instant improvement. I'm not using them now...just wondering. |
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No, not bio-identical. A bio-identical estrogen or progesterone is chemically 100% the same as the hormone produced in the body. Some HRT is bio-identical, some are based on other types of estrogen or progesterone compounds.
Estrogen and progesterone are steroids. Phytoestrogens are not steroids - they are isoflavones or lignans or other compounds that have some ability to bind to the estrogen receptor.
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nani
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #327 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 11:35am » |
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Thanks, flo. 
Really Boyce? I think this is the first time I've seen any side effects reported. I'm glad it's working for you.
The one I take has a number of other herbs in it, perhaps it helps me tolerate it better? Or it could be that what people have been telling me for years is true: I'm already dizzy. 
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floridian
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #328 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 11:37am » |
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on Mar 7th, 2005, 10:20am, Boyce wrote:
Whole-E-Cow!!! 2250mg???? If I go over about 750mg in a day's time I get all dizzy and light headed...
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There are different brands - Solaray and Nature's Way use concentrated extracts. They don't say how concentrated, but for other herbs, it may be a 4x to 20x concentration (they take out the wood, starch, and other inactive ingredients). Planetary Herbs is a mix of kudzu and other herbs - the 750 mg is total for the tablet.
Definitely a good idea to start within the reccommended doses for the brand you are using... going above that dose may increase the risk of side effects.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 7th, 2005, 12:01pm by floridian » |
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #329 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 12:02pm » |
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So far, only two notable side effects: My skin seems to be more acne prone, and uh... it makes me poop a lot. 
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floridian
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #330 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 12:11pm » |
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I thought I noticed an increase in pimples myself - I am not in cycle, but taking it for blood pressure/tinnitus. A few more pimples on the shoulders at first, seems to be calming down recently.
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nani
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #331 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 1:20pm » |
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on Mar 7th, 2005, 11:37am, floridian wrote:
Definitely a good idea to start within the reccommended doses for the brand you are using... going above that dose may increase the risk of side effects.
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Agreed. At 3 tablets a day I will still only be taking half of what the bottle recommends.
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ozzy
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #332 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 1:32pm » |
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Good weekend, and once again great for shadows. No noticeable acne activity that couldn't be attributed to other causes.
Also if there is an increase of acne, wouldn't that mean there is an increase of androgenic hormones?
Ozzy
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #333 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 1:33pm » |
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on Mar 7th, 2005, 1:32pm, ozzy wrote:Good weekend, and once again great for shadows. No noticeable acne activity that couldn't be attributed to other causes.
Also if there is an increase of acne, wouldn't that mean there is an increase of androgenic hormones?
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Hey, I'm only up to a B cup, Ozzy!
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ozzy
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #334 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 1:42pm » |
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Hey Frank, actually it would be the other way around, more in the testosterone family....
Ozzy
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #335 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 1:46pm » |
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Oh! *clearing throat and speaking in a MANLY MAN voice* So.... *scratch scratch* How 'bout them Bears?
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Bob P
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #336 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 2:51pm » |
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Quote:Use of testosterone in the treatment of cluster headache.
Klimek A
The study was carried out on 15 men suffering from the episodic form (12 patients) and the chronic one (3 patients) of cluster headache. Before treatment the patients did not receive any drugs, and after determining the index of attacks the treatment was commenced. For 7-10 days patients were given testosteronum propionicum (25 mg) once a day intramuscularly, and then for the same period of time testosterone (10 mg). Before treatment the index of attacks was 3.66 (total number of attacks 308 ). In the 1st week of treatment the index decreased to 1.11 (total number of attacks 94) and to 0.16 in the 2nd week. In 3 patients with the chronic form of cluster headache testosterone was ineffective. |
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| « Last Edit: Mar 7th, 2005, 2:52pm by Bob P » |
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ozzy
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #337 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 3:00pm » |
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Bob, BTW I'm not saying that an increase of androgenic hormones is the mechanism of action, but a side effect. (*If* it is an actual side effect)
Ozzy
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ozzy
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #338 on: Mar 7th, 2005, 3:19pm » |
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As a matter of fact it wouldn't be too bad for most men to take Kudzu, as it appears to be beneficial in the prevention of prostate cancer....
Quote:Suppressive effects of dietary genistin and daidzin on rat prostate carcinogenesis.
Kato K, Takahashi S, Cui L, Toda T, Suzuki S, Futakuchi M, Sugiura S, Shirai T.
First Department of Pathology, Nagoya City University Medical School, Mizuho-ku, Nagoya 467-8601, Japan. kojikato@med.nagoya-cu.ac.jp
High intake of phytoestrogens through soybeans and their products is thought to be associated with low incidences of prostate and / or breast cancer in Asian countries. Possible chemopreventive effects of genistin or daidzin on rat prostate carcinogenesis were therefore investigated. Male F344 rats were given 10 biweekly subcutaneous injections of 3,2'-dimethyl-4-aminobiphenyl (DMAB) and then either genistin or daidzin in the diet at a concentration of 0.1% for 40 weeks. Other groups of rats given DMAB were treated with genistin or daidzin together with a high dose of testosterone propionate (TP). Both genistin and daidzin reduced the numbers of ventral prostate carcinomas (P < 0.05), with a tendency for decrease in incidence. Invasive carcinomas which developed in the anterior prostate and seminal vesicles with TP were, however, not influenced by the two isoflavones. Thus, the present data suggest that genistin and daidzin possess anti-cancer effects at relatively early stages of prostate cancer development, providing experimental support for epidemiological findings. |
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seasonalboomer
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #339 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 9:25am » |
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I'm going to begin tapering off the zu beginning today with hopes that the storm has passed. I'm cutting dose half to 613mg 3 x daily for 2 days to see how things go. I'll let you all know how it goes.
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #340 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 10:20am » |
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Ditto, Boomer. I've been pain-free since last Friday, so this morning, I skipped it. I'll see how it goes, this evening. *crossing fingers*
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LeLimey
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #341 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 10:21am » |
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okay I have my natures way kudzu and I started off with 2 tabs (613mg) 3 times a day. I'm taking verap too and also b complex and magnesium. All day sunday I was so dizzy I couldn't even sit up without feeling like I was going to fall over.
SO.. yesterday I cut it to one tab 3x daily and got the brown and tacky stuff hammered out of me last night.
I've decided to try taking 1 tab 6 x a day again today but I'm going to space everything out so I don't take verap and zu at the same time ever.
Has anyone else been really dizzy and did it go?
Other than the dizzyness its been great. Apart from last night I had one hit since starting it but more shadows.
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nani
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #342 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 10:39am » |
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I'm glad you're getting some relief, Helen. It sounds like spacing the verap and the kudzu is a good idea. Keep an eye on your blood pressure, since kudzu has some BP lowering effects as well.
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LeLimey
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #343 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 10:49am » |
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I'm keeping an eye on my BP nani.. its still normal but I do have a low BP anyway. Good advice though so thank you!
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godsjoy777
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::)Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #344 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 4:00pm » |
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Hey Y'ALL!!!!!!!
I think I'm finally starting to get some relief.....pray...pray....pray.....I discussed all my Cluster options with my husband last night....talking about finding another neuro....about investigating clusterbusters.....(he's much more conservative that I am....but willing to support me in anything I need)....and we decided to just go for it and increase the kudzu to 3 pills of Kudzu at night 900mgs of Nature's Way along with the rest of my stuff....ie....meletonin....magnesium....zonegran....etc....and low and behold I awoke with one fairly weak cluster that went away with a little bit of O2....then I awoke once again....purely out of 6 months of habit I guess......WITHOUT ANY HEADACHE......I got up and drank some water and went back to bed and slept like a baby....
Pray that I continue to have success.....
Love y'all
Karen
PS....wedding went off without a hitch...my daughter and her hubby are in Hawaii right now on their honeymoon....sigh!
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #345 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 5:06pm » |
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OUTSTANDING, Karen!! WHOO-HOO!! 
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nani
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #346 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 5:23pm » |
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That's great Karen!! I'm so glad it's finally kicking in for you!
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Tim_Z
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #347 on: Mar 8th, 2005, 10:48pm » |
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I've been folowing this thread and think this is just amazing. I am not due for my next cycle for a little under two years, maybe by then all of the bugs will be worked out. Hopefully it will work for me.
Floridian, I read where you said that it was helping for your tinnitus, can you tell me more? Mine comes and goes, the last two or three days I have had this high pitched ringing (my sister has it and says her's is a low pitched hum). My BP is usally around 130/88.
This is one great thread, thanks Floridian.
Tim
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floridian
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #348 on: Mar 9th, 2005, 6:22am » |
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on Mar 8th, 2005, 10:48pm, Tim_Z wrote:
Floridian, I read where you said that it was helping for your tinnitus, can you tell me more? Mine comes and goes, the last two or three days I have had this high pitched ringing (my sister has it and says her's is a low pitched hum). My BP is usally around 130/88.
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The use of kudzu for tinnitus is a traditional one listed everywhere, but I'm not sure about how effective it is - I haven't seen any clear change yet. There are different causes of tinnitus - mine is on one side, and gets really loud when I clench my jaw. It also tends to be louder when my neck gets bent out of shape while I sleep. For some people, the tinnitus is more a microcirculation issue.
My blood pressure has been closer to normal since starting kudzu - in the 120s over 80s, down around 10-20 points.
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Jeepgun
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Re: 5-HT activity in Kudzu
« Reply #349 on: Mar 9th, 2005, 7:57am » |
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Well, I went off of the kudzu and was pain-free since Friday. I was optimistic that the kudzu would act on the cycle the way a prednisone taper would. I got hit last night with a Kip-7. So.... Back on the 'zu. The cool thing is, it IS working!
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